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		<title>Pratchett, Terry -- Discworld No. 22, The Last Continent (1998)</title>
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		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Oct 2025 23:22:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Pratchett, Terry]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[beer]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[brainstorm]]></category>
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		<description><![CDATA[A flash of inspiration struck him with all the force and brilliance that ideas have when they’re travelling through beer.]]></description>
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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A flash of inspiration struck him with all the force and brilliance that ideas have when they’re travelling through beer. </p>
<br><b>Terry Pratchett</b> (1948-2015) English author<br>Discworld No. 22, <i>The Last Continent</i> (1998) 
									<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;(<a href="https://archive.org/details/lastcontinentdi00prat/page/174/mode/2up?q=%22flash+of+inspiration%22" target="_blank">Source</a>)
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		<title>Horace -- Epistles [Epistularum, Letters], Book 1, ep.  1 &#8220;To Maecenas,&#8221; l.  38ff (1.1.38-40) (20 BC) [tr. Creech (1684)]</title>
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		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Aug 2025 16:20:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Horace]]></category>
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		<description><![CDATA[The Rash, the Lazy, Lover, none&#8217;s so wild, But may be tame, and may be wisely mild, If they consult true Vertue&#8217;s Rules with care, And lend to good advice a patient ear. [Invidus, iracundus, iners, vinosus, amator, nemo adeo ferus est, ut non mitescere possit, si modo culturae patientem commodet aurem.] (Source (Latin)). Other [&#8230;]]]></description>
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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Rash, the Lazy, Lover, none&#8217;s so wild,<br />
But may be tame, and may be wisely mild,<br />
If they consult true Vertue&#8217;s Rules with care,<br />
And lend to good advice a patient ear.</p>
<p><em>[Invidus, iracundus, iners, vinosus, amator,<br />
nemo adeo ferus est, ut non mitescere possit,<br />
si modo culturae patientem commodet aurem.]</em></p>
<br><b>Horace</b> (65–8 BC) Roman poet, satirist, soldier, politician [Quintus Horatius Flaccus]<br><i>Epistles [Epistularum, Letters]</i>, Book 1, ep.  1 &#8220;To Maecenas,&#8221; l.  38ff (1.1.38-40) (20 BC) [tr. Creech (1684)] 
									<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;(<a href="https://quod.lib.umich.edu/cgi/t/text/text-idx?cc=eebo;c=eebo;idno=a44471.0001.001;node=A44471.0001.001:8;seq=1;rgn=div1;view=text#:~:text=The%20Rash%2C%20the,a%20patient%20ear." target="_blank">Source</a>)
										<br><br><span class="cite">
						

(<a href="https://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus%3Atext%3A2008.01.0539%3Abook%3D1%3Apoem%3D1#:~:text=invidus%2C%20iracundus,commodet%20aurem.">Source (Latin)</a>). Other translations:<br><br>

<blockquote>Th'envyouse, angrye, drunken, slowe, the lover lewde and wylde<br>
None so outeragiouse, but in tyme he maye become full mylde.<br>
If he to good advertisemente will retche his listenyng eare,<br>
And meekely byde with pacience the counsaile he shall heare.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://quod.lib.umich.edu/e/eebo/A03670.0001.001/1:7?rgn=div1;view=fulltext#:~:text=Th%27enuyouse%2C%20angrye%2C%20drunken,he%20shall%20heare.">Drant</a> (1567)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>The Envious, Wrathful, Sluggish, Drunkard, Lover:<br>
No Beast so wild, but may be tam'd, if he<br>
Will unto Precepts listen patiently.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://quod.lib.umich.edu/cgi/t/text/text-idx?cc=eebo;c=eebo;idno=a44478.0001.001;node=A44478.0001.001:8;seq=1;rgn=div1;view=text#:~:text=T%E2%80%A2e,Precepts%20listen%20patiently.">Fanshawe</a>; ed. Brome (1666)] </blockquote><br>

<blockquote>The slave to envy, anger, wine, or love, <br>
The wretch of sloth, its excellence shall prove: <br>
Fierceness itself shall hear its rage away. <br>
When listening calmly to the instructive lay.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/satiresepistlesi00hora/page/164/mode/2up?q=%22envy%2C+anger%22">Francis</a> (1747)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>The heart with envy cold -- with anger hot, <br>
The libertine, the sluggard and the sot -- <br>
No wretch so savage, but, if he resign <br>
His soul to culture, wisdom can refine.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/The_Epodes_Satires_and_Epistles_of_Horac/TPgDAAAAQAAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&bsq=%22vice%20to%20renounce%22">Howes</a> (1845)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>The envious, the choleric, the indolent, the slave to wine, to women -- none is so savage that he can not be tamed, if he will only lend a patient ear to discipline.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/The_works_of_Horace/First_Book_of_Epistles#:~:text=The%20envious%2C%20the%20choleric%2C%20the%20indolent%2C%20the%20slave%20to%20wine%2C%20to%20women%E2%80%94none%20is%20so%20savage%20that%20he%20can%20not%20be%20tamed%2C%20if%20he%20will%20only%20lend%20a%20patient%20ear%20to%20discipline.">Smart/Buckley</a> (1853)] </blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Run through the list of faults; whate'er you be,<br>
Coward, pickthank, spitfire, drunkard, debauchee,<br>
Submit to culture patiently, you'll find<br>
Her charms can humanize the rudest mind.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/The_Satires,_Epistles_%26_Art_of_Poetry_of_Horace/Ep1-1#:~:text=Run%20through%20the%20list%20of%20faults%3B%20whate%27er%20you%20be%2C%0ACoward%2C%20pickthank%2C%20spitfire%2C%20drunkard%2C%20debauchee%2C%0ASubmit%20to%20culture%20patiently%2C%20you%27ll%20find%0AHer%20charms%20can%20humanize%20the%20rudest%20mind.">Conington</a> (1874)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>However coarse in grain a man may be,<br>
Drone, brawler, makebate, drunkard, debauchee,<br>
A patient ear to culture let him lend,<br>
He's sure to turn out gentler in the end.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/worksofhorace02horauoft/page/266/mode/2up?q=%22coarse+in+grain%22">Martin</a> (1881)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Are you envious, irascible, inert, given to wine or immorality? No person is so savage that he cannot grow milder, provided he lend a patient ear to civilization's culture.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/The_Works_of_Horace/-f8pAAAAYAAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&bsq=%22unable%20to%20see%22">Elgood</a> (1893)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>The slave to envy, anger, sloth, wine, lewdness -- no one is so savage that he cannot be tamed, if only he lend to treatment a patient ear.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/satiresepistlesa00horauoft/page/254/mode/2up?q=%22slave+to+envy%22">Fairclough</a> (Loeb) (1926)]</blockquote><br>



<blockquote>The envious, passionate, slothful, drunken, lewd — <br>
No man so savage but he drops the mood,<br>
Lend he but patient ear to counsel good.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/completeworksofh0000casp_g2w3/page/306/mode/2up?q=%22the+envious%2C+passionate%22">Murison</a>, ed. Kramer (1936)]</blockquote><br>





<blockquote><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab">The envious man,<br>
The sorehead, the lazy lout, the drinker, the lover:<br>
No one is such a beast as not to be tamed<br>
By lending a patient ear to moral advice.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/satiresanndepist0000hora/page/166/mode/2up?q=sorehead">Palmer Bovie</a> (1959)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Envious, wrathful, lazy, drunken men, lewd lovers too, <br>
none is so thoroughly wild a beast he can't be tamed, <br>
if only he'll lend for cultivation's sake an open ear.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/horacessatiresep0000hora/page/50/mode/2up?q=%22envious%2C+wrathful%22">Fuchs</a> (1977)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab">Jealousy,<br>
Anger, laziness, drunkenness, lust: everything<br>
Can be cured, nothing is so wild <br>
That patient teaching will ever fail you.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/essentialhoraceo0000hora/page/198/mode/2up?q=%22anger%2C+laziness%22">Raffel</a> (1983)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Nobody's so far gone in savagery --<br>
A slave of envy, wrath, lust, drunkenness, sloth --<br>
That he can't be civilized, if he'll only listen<br>
Patiently to the doctor's good advice.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/The_Epistles_of_Horace/FUyHO-GZ9A8C?hl=en&gbpv=1&bsq=%22gone%20in%20savagery%22">Ferry</a> (2001)] </blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Whether he’s envious, choleric, indolent, drunken or lustful -- <br>
no one is so unruly that he can’t become more gentle,<br>
if only he listens with care to what his trainer tells him.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/satiresofhoracep00hora/page/78/mode/2up?q=%22envious%2C+choleric%22">Rudd</a> (2005 ed.)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Envious, irascible, idle, drunken, lustful,<br>
No man’s so savage he can’t be civilised,<br>
If he’ll attend patiently to self-cultivation.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.poetryintranslation.com/PITBR/Latin/HoraceEpistlesBkIEpI.php#anchor_Toc98156301:~:text=Envious%2C%20irascible%2C%20idle,to%20self%2Dcultivation.">Kline</a> (2015)]</blockquote><br>						</span>
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		<title>Russell, Bertrand -- Conquest of Happiness, Part 1, ch.  1 &#8220;What Makes People Unhappy?&#8221; (1930)</title>
		<link>https://wist.info/russell-bertrand/76016/</link>
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		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Apr 2025 16:34:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Russell, Bertrand]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[alcohol]]></category>
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		<description><![CDATA[A man may feel so completely thwarted that he seeks no form of satisfaction, but only distraction and oblivion. He then becomes a devotee of &#8220;pleasure.&#8221; That is to say, he seeks to make life bearable by becoming less alive. Drunkenness, for example, is temporary suicide: the happiness that it brings is merely negative, a [&#8230;]]]></description>
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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A man may feel so completely thwarted that he seeks no form of satisfaction, but only distraction and oblivion. He then becomes a devotee of &#8220;pleasure.&#8221; That is to say, he seeks to make life bearable by becoming less alive. Drunkenness, for example, is temporary suicide: the happiness that it brings is merely negative, a momentary cessation of unhappiness.</p>
<br><b>Bertrand Russell</b> (1872-1970) English mathematician and philosopher<br><i>Conquest of Happiness</i>, Part 1, ch.  1 &#8220;What Makes People Unhappy?&#8221; (1930) 
									<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;(<a href="https://archive.org/details/in.ernet.dli.2015.222834/page/n27/mode/2up?q=%22completely+thwarted%22" target="_blank">Source</a>)
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		<title>Omar Khayyam -- Rubáiyát [رباعیات], Bod. # 146 [tr. Talbot (1908)]</title>
		<link>https://wist.info/omar-khayyam/74205/</link>
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		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Jan 2025 23:26:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Omar Khayyam]]></category>
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		<description><![CDATA[Last night I smote the winecup on a stone; For such mad folly how may I atone? The shatter&#8217;d cup, in mystic language, said, &#8220;I was like thee, my fate shall be thine own.&#8221; Alternate translations: Last night I dashed my clay cup on the stone, And at the reckless freak my heart was glad, [&#8230;]]]></description>
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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Last night I smote the winecup on a stone;<br />
For such mad folly how may I atone?<br />
<span class="tab">The shatter&#8217;d cup, in mystic language, said,<br />
&#8220;I was like thee, my fate shall be thine own.&#8221;</p>
<p><a href="https://wist.info/wp/wp-content/uploads/2025/01/rubaiyat-146-bod.gif"><img fetchpriority="high" decoding="async" src="https://wist.info/wp/wp-content/uploads/2025/01/rubaiyat-146-bod.gif" alt="rubaiyat 146 bod" title="rubaiyat 146 bod" width="356" height="178" class="alignright size-full wp-image-74208" /></a></span></p>
<br><b>Omar Khayyám </b> (1048-1123) Persian poet, mathematician, philosopher, astronomer [عمر خیام]<br><i>Rubáiyát</i> [رباعیات], Bod. # 146 [tr. Talbot (1908)] 
									<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;(<a href="https://rubaiyatconcordance.org/translations/talbot---1908.html#:~:text=Last%20night%20I%20smote%20the%20winecup%20on%20a%20stone%3B%0AFor%20such%20mad%20folly%20how%20may%20I%20atone%3F%0AThe%20shatter%27d%20cup%2C%20in%20mystic%20language%2C%20said%2C%0A%22I%20was%20like%20thee%2C%20my%20fate%20shall%20be%20thine%20own.%22" target="_blank">Source</a>)
										<br><br><span class="cite">
						

Alternate translations:<br><br>

<blockquote>Last night I dashed my clay cup on the stone,<br>
And at the reckless freak my heart was glad,<br>
<span class="tab">When with a voice for the moment out spake the cup,<br>
"I was once as thou and thou shalt be as I!"<br>
[tr. <a href="https://rubaiyatconcordance.org/translations/cowell---1858.html#:~:text=Last%20night%20I%20dashed%20my%20clay%20cup%20on%20the%20stone%2C%0AAnd%20at%20the%20reckless%20freak%20my%20heart%20was%20glad%2C%0AWhen%20with%20a%20voice%20for%20the%20moment%20out%20spake%20the%20cup%2C%0A%22I%20was%20once%20as%20thou%20and%20thou%20shalt%20be%20as%20I!%22">Cowell</a> (1858), # 29]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Last eve I broke against a stone an earthen cup, drunk in the doing of the foolish deed. Methought the cup protested unto me "I was like thee, thou wilt be like to me."<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/rubiytofomark00omar/page/134/mode/2up?q=CCCXCV">McCarthy</a> (1879), # 395]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Last night I dashed my cup against a stone.<br>
In a mad drunken freak, as I must own,<br>
<span class="tab">And lo! the cup cries out in agony,<br>
"You too, like me, shall soon be overthrown."<br>
[tr. <a href="https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Quatrains_of_Omar_Khayyam_(tr._Whinfield,_1883)/Quatrains_401-500#:~:text=Last%20night%20I%20dashed%20my%20cup%20against%20a%20stone.%0AIn%20a%20mad%20drunken%20freak%2C%20as%20I%20must%20own%2C%0A%C2%A0%C2%A0%C2%A0%C2%A0And%20lo!%20the%20cup%20cries%20out%20in%20agony%2C%0A%22You%20too%2C%20like%20me%2C%20shall%20soon%20be%20overthrown.%22">Whinfield</a> (1883), # 446]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>I smote the glass wine cup upon a stone last night,<br>
my head was turned that I did so base a thing;<br>
<span class="tab">the cup said to me in mystic language,<br>
"I was like thee, and thou also wilt be like me."<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/proseandverse_heronallen_talbot_rubaiyatofomarkhayyam_text/page/n43/mode/2up?q=146">Heron-Allen</a> (1898), # 146]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Last night the cup I dashed against a stone.<br>
Base was the act, my head with wine was flown.<br>
<span class="tab">The cup cried out to me in mystic tone,<br>
"I was like thee, my case will be thine own."<br>
[tr. <a href="https://rubaiyatconcordance.org/translations/thompson---1906.html#:~:text=Last%20night%20the%20cup%20I%20dashed%20against%20a%20stone.%0ABase%20was%20the%20act%2C%20my%20head%20with%20wine%20was%20flown.%0AThe%20cup%20cried%20out%20to%20me%20in%20mystic%20tone%2C%0A%22I%20was%20like%20thee%2C%20my%20case%20will%20be%20thine%20own">Thompson</a> (1906), # 554]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Against the stone, last night, I flung the wine-bowl of<br>
faience. I was drunk when I did that brutal action.<br>
<span class="tab">The bowl said to me in the language of bowls: "I was<br>
what thou art, thou also shall be what I am."<br>
[tr. <a href="https://rubaiyatconcordance.org/translations/christensen---1927.html#:~:text=Against%20the%20stone%2C%20last%20night%2C%20I%20flung%20the%20wine%2Dbowl%20of%0Afaience.%20I%20was%20drunk%20when%20I%20did%20that%20brutal%20action.%0AThe%20bowl%20said%20to%20me%20in%20the%20language%20of%20bowls%3A%20%27I%20was%0Awhat%20thou%20art%2C%20thou%20also%20shall%20be%20what%20I%20am.%22">Christensen</a> (1927), # 36]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Yesterday I knocked my earthenware wine-jug against a stone.<br>
I must have been inebriated to have committed such an offence.<br>
<span class="tab">It seemed as if the jug thus spoke to me:<br>
"I have been as thou and thou wilt be as I".<br>
[tr. <a href="https://rubaiyatconcordance.org/translations/rosen---1928.html#:~:text=Yesterday%20I%20knocked%20my%20earthenware%20wine%2Djug%20against%20a%20stone.%0AI%20must%20have%20been%20inebriated%20to%20have%20committed%20such%20an%20offence.%0AIt%20seemed%20as%20if%20the%20jug%20thus%20spoke%20to%20me%3A%0A%22I%20have%20been%20as%20thou%20and%20thou%20wilt%20be%20as%20I%22.">Rosen</a> (1928), # 299]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>In frolic once on stone I dashed a pot,<br>
Alas! such wanton freaks come from a sot;<br>
<span class="tab">The pot then told me as if in a trance:<br>
"Like thee I was, like me now find thy lot."<br>
[tr. <a href="https://rubaiyatconcordance.org/translations/tirtha---1941.html#:~:text=In%20frolic%20once%20on%20stone%20I%20dashed%20a%20pot%2C%0AAlas!%20such%20wanton%20freaks%20come%20from%20a%20sot%3B%0AThe%20pot%20then%20told%20me%20as%20if%20in%20a%20trance%3A%0A%22Like%20thee%20I%20was%2C%20like%20me%20now%20find%20thy%20lot.%22">Tirtha</a> (1941), # 5.31]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>When foolishly I dashed my bowl against a stone,<br>
It answered sadly in a voice how like my own:<br>
<span class="tab">"I once was proudly filled with wine as full as thou:<br>
So, broken in the dust, thou'lt lie as I do now."<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/isbn_0856680389/page/68/mode/2up?q=%22when+foolishly%22">Bowen</a> (1976), # 34]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Last night I dashed (my) pottery bowl against the stones; I was intoxicated, when I committed this folly. It was as if the bowl spoke to me, "I was even such a one as thou, and thou too shalt (someday) be even as I."<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/isbn_0856680389/page/68/mode/2up">Bowen</a> (1976), # 34, literal]</blockquote><br>
						</span>
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                <!-- DCH Modify the title to give the category (quote author) at the beginning of it. -->
		<title>Euripides -- Cyclops [Κύκλωψ], l. 678ff (c. 424-23 BC) [tr. Coleridge (1913)]</title>
		<link>https://wist.info/euripides/73316/</link>
		<comments>https://wist.info/euripides/73316/#respond</comments>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Dec 2024 17:47:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Euripides]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[alcohol]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[drunkenness]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[intoxication]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[wine]]></category>

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		<description><![CDATA[CHORUS LEADER: Ah! wine is a terrible foe, hard to wrestle with. [ΧΟΡΟΣ: δεινὸς γὰρ οἷνος καὶ παλαίεσθαι βαρύς.] (Source (Greek)). Alternate translations: CHORUS: Wine is invincible. [tr. Wodhull (1809)] CYCLOPS: For wine is strong and hard to struggle with. [tr. Shelley (1824)] CHORUS: Ah, wine’s the chap to trip your legs, I think. [tr. [&#8230;]]]></description>
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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p class="hangingindent">CHORUS LEADER: Ah! wine is a terrible foe, hard to wrestle with.</p>
<p></p>
<p>[ΧΟΡΟΣ: δεινὸς γὰρ οἷνος καὶ παλαίεσθαι βαρύς.]</p>
<br><b>Euripides</b> (485?-406? BC) Greek tragic dramatist<br><i>Cyclops</i> [Κύκλωψ], l. 678ff (c. 424-23 BC) [tr. Coleridge (1913)] 
									<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;(<a href="https://classics.mit.edu/Euripides/cyclops.html#:~:text=Ah!%20wine%20is%20a%20terrible%20foe%2C%20hard%20to%20wrestle%20with." target="_blank">Source</a>)
										<br><br><span class="cite">
						

(<a href="https://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus%3Atext%3A1999.01.0093%3Acard%3D663#:~:text=%CE%B4%CE%B5%CE%B9%CE%BD%E1%BD%B8%CF%82%20%CE%B3%E1%BD%B0%CF%81%20%CE%BF%E1%BC%B7%CE%BD%CE%BF%CF%82%20%CE%BA%CE%B1%E1%BD%B6%20%CF%80%CE%B1%CE%BB%CE%B1%CE%AF%CE%B5%CF%83%CE%B8%CE%B1%CE%B9%20%CE%B2%CE%B1%CF%81%CF%8D%CF%82.">Source (Greek)</a>). Alternate translations: <br><br>

<blockquote>CHORUS: Wine is invincible.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/nineteentragedi00wodhgoog/page/448/mode/2up?q=%22Wine+i%C2%BB+invmoibk%22">Wodhull</a> (1809)] </blockquote><br>

<blockquote>CYCLOPS: For wine is strong and hard to struggle with.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Cyclops_(Shelley_1824)#:~:text=For%20wine%20is%20strong%20and%20hard%20to%20struggle%20with.">Shelley</a> (1824)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>CHORUS: Ah, wine’s the chap to trip your legs, I think.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/LoebClassicalLibraryL009/page/587/mode/2up?q=%22wine%E2%80%99s+the+chap%22">Way</a> (1916)] </blockquote><br>

<blockquote>CHORUS-LEADER: Yes, wine is a dangerous thing and hard to wrestle against.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus%3Atext%3A1999.01.0094%3Acard%3D663#:~:text=Yes%2C%20wine%20is%20a%20dangerous%20thing%20and%20hard%20to%20wrestle%20against.">Kovacs</a> (1994)] </blockquote><br>
						</span>
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                <!-- DCH Modify the title to give the category (quote author) at the beginning of it. -->
		<title>Euripides -- Cyclops [Κύκλωψ], l. 503ff (c. 424-23 BC) [tr. Shelley (1824)]</title>
		<link>https://wist.info/euripides/73197/</link>
		<comments>https://wist.info/euripides/73197/#respond</comments>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Dec 2024 17:23:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Euripides]]></category>
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		<description><![CDATA[CYCLOPS: Ha! ha! ha! I&#8217;m full of wine, Heavy with the joy divine, With the young feast oversated; Like a merchant&#8217;s vessel freighted To the water&#8217;s edge, my crop Is laden to the gullet&#8217;s top. The fresh meadow grass of spring Tempts me forth thus wandering To my brothers on the mountains, Who shall share [&#8230;]]]></description>
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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p class="hangingindent">CYCLOPS: Ha! ha! ha! I&#8217;m full of wine,<br />
<span class="tab">Heavy with the joy divine,<br />
With the young feast oversated;<br />
<span class="tab">Like a merchant&#8217;s vessel freighted<br />
To the water&#8217;s edge, my crop<br />
<span class="tab">Is laden to the gullet&#8217;s top.<br />
The fresh meadow grass of spring<br />
<span class="tab">Tempts me forth thus wandering<br />
To my brothers on the mountains,<br />
<span class="tab">Who shall share the wine&#8217;s sweet fountains.<br />
<span class="tab">Bring the cask, O stranger, bring!</span></span></span></span></span></span></p>
<p></p>
<p class="hangingindent">[ΚΥΚΛΩΨ: παπαπαῖ: πλέως μὲν οἴνου,<br />
γάνυμαι δὲ δαιτὸς ἥβᾳ,<br />
σκάφος ὁλκὰς ὣς γεμισθεὶς<br />
ποτὶ σέλμα γαστρὸς ἄκρας.<br />
ὑπάγει μ᾽ ὁ φόρτος εὔφρων<br />
ἐπὶ κῶμον ἦρος ὥραις<br />
ἐπὶ Κύκλωπας ἀδελφούς.<br />
φέρε μοι, ξεῖνε, φέρ᾽, ἀσκὸν ἔνδος μοι.]</p>
<p></p>
<br><b>Euripides</b> (485?-406? BC) Greek tragic dramatist<br><i>Cyclops</i> [Κύκλωψ], l. 503ff (c. 424-23 BC) [tr. Shelley (1824)] 
									<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;(<a href="https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Cyclops_(Shelley_1824)#:~:text=Ha!%20ha!%20ha,wine%27s%20sweet%20fountains." target="_blank">Source</a>)
										<br><br><span class="cite">
						

(<a href="http://data.perseus.org/citations/urn:cts:greekLit:tlg0006.tlg001.perseus-grc1:503-510">Source (Greek)</a>). Alternate translations: <br><br>

<blockquote>POLYPHEME: Ha! ha! I am replete with wine, the banquet <br>
Hath cheer'd my soul: like a well-freighted ship<br>
My stomach's with abundant viands stow'd<br>
Up to my very chin. This smiling turf<br>
Invites me to partake a vernal feast<br>
With my Cyclopean brothers.  Stranger, bring<br>
That vessel from the cave.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/nineteentragedi00wodhgoog/page/436/mode/2up?q=%22replete+witji+wine%22">Wodhull</a> (1809)] </blockquote><br>

<blockquote>CYCLOPS: Ha! ha! full of wine and merry with a feast's good cheer am I, my hold freighted like a merchant-ship up to my belly's very top. This turf graciously invites me to seek my brother Cyclopes for revel in the spring-tide. Come, stranger, bring the wine-skin hither and hand it over to me.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://classics.mit.edu/Euripides/cyclops.html#:~:text=Ha!%20ha!%20full%20of%20wine%20and%20merry%20with%20a%20feast%27s%20good%20cheer%20am%20I%2C%20my%20hold%20freighted%20like%20a%20merchant%2Dship%20up%20to%20my%20belly%27s%20very%20top.%20This%20turf%20graciously%20invites%20me%20to%20seek%20my%20brother%20Cyclopes%20for%20revel%20in%20the%20spring%2Dtide.">Coleridge</a> (1913)] </blockquote><br>

<blockquote>CYCLOPS: Oho! Oho! I am full of good drink, <br>
<span class="tab">Full of glee from a good feast’s revel! <br>
I’m a ship that is laden till ready to sink <br>
<span class="tab">Right up to my crop’s deck-level! <br>
The jolly spring season is tempting me out <br>
<span class="tab">To dance on the meadow-clover <br>
With my Cyclop brothers in revel-rout! -- <br>
<span class="tab">Here, hand the wine-skin over!<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/LoebClassicalLibraryL009/page/567/mode/2up?q=%22full+of+good+drink%22">Way</a> (1916)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>CYCLOPS: Ooh la la! I'm loaded up with wine, my heart skips with the cheer of the feast. My hull is full right up to the top-deck of my belly. This cheerful cargo brings me out to revel, in the springtime, to the houses of my brother Cyclopes. Come now, my friend, come now, give me the wine-skin.<br>
[tr. <a href="http://data.perseus.org/citations/urn:cts:greekLit:tlg0006.tlg001.perseus-eng1:503-510">Kovacs</a> (1994)] </blockquote><br>

						</span>
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                <!-- DCH Modify the title to give the category (quote author) at the beginning of it. -->
		<title>Euripides -- Cyclops [Κύκλωψ], l. 445ff (c. 424-23 BC) [tr. Way (Loeb) (1916)]</title>
		<link>https://wist.info/euripides/72429/</link>
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		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Oct 2024 21:35:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Euripides]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[drinking]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[drunkenness]]></category>
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		<description><![CDATA[ODYSSEUS: He wants to go forth, full of wine and glee, To his brother Cyclops for wild revelry. [ΟΔΥΣΣΕΥΣ: ἐπὶ κῶμον ἕρπειν πρὸς κασιγνήτους θέλει Κύκλωπας ἡσθεὶς τῷδε Βακχίου ποτῷ.] Regarding the Cyclops keeping he and his men prisoner, and who he has introduced to the wonders of wine. (Source (Greek)). Alternate translations: ULYSSES: By [&#8230;]]]></description>
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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p class="hangingindent">ODYSSEUS: He wants to go forth, full of wine and glee,<br />
To his brother Cyclops for wild revelry.</p>
<p></p>
<p class="hangingindent">[ΟΔΥΣΣΕΥΣ: ἐπὶ κῶμον ἕρπειν πρὸς κασιγνήτους θέλει<br />
Κύκλωπας ἡσθεὶς τῷδε Βακχίου ποτῷ.]</p>
<p></p>
<br><b>Euripides</b> (485?-406? BC) Greek tragic dramatist<br><i>Cyclops</i> [Κύκλωψ], l. 445ff (c. 424-23 BC) [tr. Way (Loeb) (1916)] 
									<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;(<a href="https://archive.org/details/LoebClassicalLibraryL009/page/563/mode/2up?q=%22He+wants+to+go+forth%22" target="_blank">Source</a>)
										<br><br><span class="cite">
						

Regarding the Cyclops keeping he and his men prisoner, and who he has introduced to the wonders of wine. <br><br>

(<a href="https://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus%3Atext%3A1999.01.0093%3Acard%3D441#:~:text=%E1%BC%90%CF%80%E1%BD%B6%20%CE%BA%E1%BF%B6%CE%BC%CE%BF%CE%BD%20%E1%BC%95%CF%81%CF%80%CE%B5%CE%B9%CE%BD%20%CF%80%CF%81%E1%BD%B8%CF%82%20%CE%BA%CE%B1%CF%83%CE%B9%CE%B3%CE%BD%CE%AE%CF%84%CE%BF%CF%85%CF%82%20%CE%B8%CE%AD%CE%BB%CE%B5%CE%B9%0A%CE%9A%CF%8D%CE%BA%CE%BB%CF%89%CF%80%CE%B1%CF%82%20%E1%BC%A1%CF%83%CE%B8%CE%B5%E1%BD%B6%CF%82%20%CF%84%E1%BF%B7%CE%B4%CE%B5%20%CE%92%CE%B1%CE%BA%CF%87%CE%AF%CE%BF%CF%85%20%CF%80%CE%BF%CF%84%E1%BF%B7.">Source (Greek)</a>). Alternate translations: <br><br>

<blockquote>ULYSSES: By wine enliven'd, he resolves to go <br>
And revel with his brethren.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/nineteentragedi00wodhgoog/page/434/mode/2up?q=%22By+wine+enliven%27d%22">Wodhull</a> (1809)] </blockquote><br>

<blockquote>ULYSSES: Delighted with the Bacchic drink he goes <br>
To call his brother Cyclops -- who inhabit <br>
A village upon Aetna not far off.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Cyclops_(Shelley_1824)#:~:text=ULYSSES%3A%20Delighted%20with%20the%20Bacchic%20drink%20he%20goes%20To%20call%20his%20brother%20Cyclops%2D%2Dwho%20inhabit%20A%20village%20upon%20Aetna%20not%20far%20off.">Shelley</a> (1824)] </blockquote><br>

<blockquote>ODYSSEUS: Delighted with this liquor of the Bacchic god, he fain would go a-reveling with his brethren.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://classics.mit.edu/Euripides/cyclops.html#:~:text=the%20Cyclops%27%20death.-,ODYSSEUS,Bacchic%20god%2C%20he%20fain%20would%20go%20a%2Dreveling%20with%20his%20brethren.,-LEADER">Coleridge</a> (1913)] </blockquote><br>

<blockquote>ODYSSEUS: He wants to go to his brother Cyclopes for a revel since he is delighted with this drink of Dionysus.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus%3Atext%3A1999.01.0094%3Acard%3D441#:~:text=He%20wants%20to%20go%20to%20his%20brother%20Cyclopes%20for%20a%20revel%20since%20he%20is%20delighted%20with%20this%20drink%20of%20Dionysus.">Kovacs</a> (1994)] </blockquote><br>
						</span>
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                <!-- DCH Modify the title to give the category (quote author) at the beginning of it. -->
		<title>Lessing, Gotthold -- &#8220;Answer of a Drunken Poet [Antwort eines trunknen Dichters],&#8221; Lieder, Book 1 (1771) [tr. Conlin]</title>
		<link>https://wist.info/lessing-gotthold/70791/</link>
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		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Jul 2024 20:14:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Lessing, Gotthold]]></category>
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		<description><![CDATA[A bibulous poet downed his every glass in one; so warned him his companion &#8220;Stop &#8212; that’s enough, son.&#8221; About to lose his balance He said, &#8220;I know my stuff. It’s one thing to drink too much, but one never drinks enough.&#8221; [Ein trunkner Dichter leerte Sein Glaß auf jeden Zug; Ihn Warnte sein Gefährte: [&#8230;]]]></description>
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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A bibulous poet downed<br />
<span class="tab">his every glass in one;<br />
so warned him his companion<br />
<span class="tab">&#8220;Stop &#8212; that’s enough, son.&#8221;<br />
About to lose his balance<br />
<span class="tab">He said, &#8220;I know my stuff.<br />
It’s one thing to drink too much,<br />
<span class="tab">but one never drinks enough.&#8221;</p>
<p><em>[Ein trunkner Dichter leerte<br />
<span class="tab">Sein Glaß auf jeden Zug;<br />
Ihn Warnte sein Gefährte:<br />
<span class="tab">Hör&#8217; auf! du hast genug.<br />
Bereit vom Stuhl zu sinken,<br />
<span class="tab">Sprach der: Du bist nicht klug;<br />
Zu viel kann man wohl trinken,<br />
<span class="tab">Doch nie trinkt man genug.]</span></span></span></span></em></span></span></span></span></p>
<br><b>Gotthold Lessing</b> (1729-1781) German playwright, philosopher, dramaturg, writer<br>&#8220;Answer of a Drunken Poet [Antwort eines trunknen Dichters],&#8221; <i>Lieder</i>, Book 1 (1771) [tr. Conlin] 
									<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;(<a href="https://lyricstranslate.com/en/gotthold-ephraim-les-ein-trunkner-dichter-english" target="_blank">Source</a>)
										<br><br><span class="cite">
						

Conlin titled his version, "A Bibulous Poet."<br><br>

Usually just the last two lines are quoted, e.g., "One can drink too much, but one never drinks enough" [ed. <a href="https://archive.org/details/familiarquotatio0000john_u1v0/page/454/mode/2up?q=%22drink+too+much%2C+but+one+never%22">Bartlett</a> (1964)] or "One may well drink too much, but yet one never drinks enough" [<a href="https://www.junkfoodforthought.com/quotations/H.htm#:~:text=One%20may%20well%20drink%20too%20much%2C%20but%20yet%20one%20never%20drinks%20enough.">Source</a>].<br><br>

(<a href="https://www.gutenberg.org/cache/epub/6822/pg6822-images.html#:~:text=Ein%20trunkner%20Dichter%20leerte%0ASein%20Glas%20auf%20jeden%20Zug%3B%0AIhn%20warnte%20sein%20Gef%C3%A4hrte%3A%0AH%C3%B6r%20auf!%20du%20hast%20genug.%0ABereit%20vom%20Stuhl%20zu%20sinken%2C%0ASprach%20der%3A%20Du%20bist%20nicht%20klug%3B%0AZu%20viel%20kann%20man%20wohl%20trinken%2C%0ADoch%20nie%20trinkt%20man%20genug.">Source (German)</a>). Alternate translations:<br><br>

<blockquote>A drunken poet emptied<br>
<span class="tab">His glass at every draft;<br>
And him his friend admonished,<br>
<span class="tab">Cease now! Enough you've quaffed.<br>
But from his chair a-sinking<br>
<span class="tab">He said: "You are not wise;<br>
Too much one may be drinking<br>
<span class="tab">Yet never what satisfies."<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/Poems/dbKQNXTIntwC?hl=en&gbpv=1&dq=lessing+%22drunken+poet%22&pg=PA39&printsec=frontcover">Fischer</a> (c. 1885), "Answer of a Drunken Poet"]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>A drunken poet emptied<br>
<span class="tab">His glass with every gulp;<br>
His companion warned him:<br>
<span class="tab">Cease! you have had enough.<br>
Ready to fall off his stool,<br>
<span class="tab">He said: You are not wise!<br>
Truly, one can drink too much,<br>
<span class="tab">Yet one can never drink enough.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.lieder.net/lieder/get_text.html?TextId=88415">Krebs</a> (2012), "The Answer of a Drunken Poet"]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>A drunken poet emptied<br>
<span class="tab">His glass with hefty swig;<br>
His companion warned him:<br>
<span class="tab">Hey! enough of that, you pig.<br>
Almost toppling from his stool,<br>
<span class="tab">He said: That's incorrect!<br>
Ah yes, one can drink too much,<br>
<span class="tab">But enough? That I expect.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.bachlund.org/Collected_Poetry_VII.htm#A_drunken_poet:~:text=A%20drunken%20poet%20emptied%0AHis%20glass%20with%20hefty%20swig%3B%0AHis%20companion%20warned%20him%3A%0AHey!%20enough%20of%20that%2C%20you%20pig.%0AAlmost%20toppling%20from%20his%20stool%2C%0AHe%20said%3A%20That%27s%20incorrect!%0AAh%20yes%2C%20one%20can%20drink%20too%20much%2C%0ABut%20enough%3F%20That%20I%20expect.">Bachlund</a>, "A Drunken Poet"]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>A drunken poet quickly drained<br>
<span class="tab">His glass, drawing this rebuff,<br>
Being warned by his companion:<br>
<span class="tab">"Stop it! you've drunk enough."<br>
Poised to topple out of his chair,<br>
<span class="tab">He cracked: "Clever, you're not!<br>
One can always drink too much,<br>
<span class="tab">But enough can never be got.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.bachlund.org/Antwort.htm#:~:text=A%20drunken%20poet%20quickly%20drained%0AHis%20glass%2C%20drawing%20this%20rebuff%2C%0ABeing%20warned%20by%20his%20companion%3A%0A%22Stop%20it!%20you%27ve%20drunk%20enough.%22%0APoised%20to%20topple%20out%20of%20his%20chair%2C%0AHe%20cracked%3A%20%22Clever%2C%20you%27re%20not!%0AOne%20can%20always%20drink%20too%20much%2C%0ABut%20enough%20can%20never%20be%20got.]">Bachlund</a> (2012), "Response (of a Drunken Poet)"]</blockquote><br>						</span>
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                <!-- DCH Modify the title to give the category (quote author) at the beginning of it. -->
		<title>Euripides -- Auge [Αὐγῃ], frag. 272b (TGF) (c. 408 BC) [tr. Collard/Cropp (2008)]</title>
		<link>https://wist.info/euripides/65790/</link>
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		<pubDate>Tue, 26 Dec 2023 22:12:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Euripides]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[apology]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[blame]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[deflection]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[drunkenness]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[intoxication]]></category>

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		<description><![CDATA[As it is, wine drove me out of my senses. I admit I wronged you, but the wrong was not intentional. [νοϋ δ&#8217; οίνος έξεστησέ μ&#8217; δμολογώ δέ σε άδίκείν, τὸ δ&#8217; αδίκημ&#8217; ἐγένετ&#8217; οὐχ ἑκούδίον.] Heracles apologizing (sort of), to Auge for raping her, one of the only such apologies in ancient Greek drama. [&#8230;]]]></description>
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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As it is, wine drove me out of my senses. I admit I wronged you, but the wrong was not intentional.</p>
<p>[νοϋ δ&#8217; οίνος έξεστησέ μ&#8217; δμολογώ δέ σε άδίκείν, τὸ δ&#8217; αδίκημ&#8217; ἐγένετ&#8217; οὐχ ἑκούδίον.]</p>
<br><b>Euripides</b> (485?-406? BC) Greek tragic dramatist<br><i>Auge</i> [Αὐγῃ], frag. 272b (TGF) (c. 408 BC) [tr. Collard/Cropp (2008)] 
									<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;(<a href="https://digital.lib.washington.edu/researchworks/bitstream/handle/1773/23384/Funke_washington_0250E_11924.pdf?sequence=1" target="_blank">Source</a>)
										<br><br><span class="cite">
						

Heracles apologizing (sort of), to Auge for raping her, one of the only such apologies in ancient Greek drama.<br><br>

Nauck frag. 265, Barnes frag. 6, Musgrave frag. 8. (<a href="https://archive.org/details/tragicorumgraeco00naucuoft/page/436/mode/2up?view=theater&q=%22%CE%BD%CE%BF%CF%8B+%CE%B4%27+%CE%BF%CE%AF%CE%BD%CE%BF%CF%82%22">Source (Greek)</a>). Alternate translation:<br><br>

<blockquote>My senses are disorder'd by the fumes<br>
Of wine: yet will I own that I have wrong'd thee,<br>
Tho' this be an involuntary wrong.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/nineteentragedi02wodhgoog/page/n390/mode/2up?q=%22My+senses+are+disorder%27d%22">Wodhall</a> (1809)]</blockquote><br>						</span>
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                <!-- DCH Modify the title to give the category (quote author) at the beginning of it. -->
		<title>Homer -- The Odyssey [Ὀδύσσεια], Book 11, l.  61 (11.61) [Elpenor] (c. 700 BC) [tr. Murray (1919)]</title>
		<link>https://wist.info/homer/65119/</link>
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		<pubDate>Thu, 30 Nov 2023 22:55:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Homer]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[alcohol]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[blame]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[divine wrath]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[doom]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[drunkenness]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[excuse]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[fate]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[gods]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[wine]]></category>

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		<description><![CDATA[An evil doom of some god was my undoing, and measureless wine. [ἆσέ με δαίμονος αἶσα κακὴ καὶ ἀθέσφατος οἶνος.] Odysseus first encounter in the Underworld is the shade of his comrade Elpenor, whose body had been left on Circe&#8217;s island. This is Elpenor&#8217;s explanation of his death (10.552-560). Drunk with his crew mates, he [&#8230;]]]></description>
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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>An evil doom of some god was my undoing, and measureless wine.</p>
<p>[ἆσέ με δαίμονος αἶσα κακὴ καὶ ἀθέσφατος οἶνος.]</p>
<br><b>Homer</b> (fl. 7th-8th C. BC) Greek author<br><i>The Odyssey</i> [Ὀδύσσεια], Book 11, l.  61 (11.61) [Elpenor] (c. 700 BC) [tr. Murray (1919)] 
									<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;(<a href="https://archive.org/details/odyssey0000home_i6h2/page/178/mode/2up?q=%22god+knows+how+much+wine%22" target="_blank">Source</a>)
										<br><br><span class="cite">
						

Odysseus first encounter in the Underworld is the shade of his comrade Elpenor, whose body had been left on Circe's island. This is Elpenor's explanation of his death (10.552-560). Drunk with his crew mates, he climbed a ladder to the roof of Circe's palace to sleep it off. When he heard his friends preparing to leave, he either fell from or forgot about using the ladder, plummeting to his ignominious death.<br><br>

(<a href="http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/morph?l=oi%29%3Dnos&la=greek&can=oi%29%3Dnos0&prior=a)qe/sfatos">Source (Greek)</a>). Alternate translations:<br><br>

<blockquote>In Circe’s house, the spite some spirit did bear,<br>
<span class="tab">And the unspeakable good liquor there,<br>
Hath been my bane.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.gutenberg.org/files/48895/48895-h/48895-h.htm#chap11:~:text=In%20Circe%E2%80%99s%20house%2C%20the%20spite%20some%20spirit%20did%20bear%2C%0AAnd%20the%20unspeakable%20good%20liquor%20there%2C%0AHath%20been%20my%20bane">Chapman</a> (1616)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>I had come along with th’ bark,<br>
But that the Devil and excess of wine<br>
Made me to fall, and break my neck i’ th’ dark.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://oll.libertyfund.org/title/hobbes-the-english-works-vol-x-iliad-and-odyssey#lf0051-10_head_3025">Hobbes</a> (1675), l. 54ff]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab">To hell my doom I owe,<br>
<span class="tab">Demons accursed, dire ministers of woe!<br>
My feet, through wine unfaithful to their weight,<br>
<span class="tab">Betray'd me tumbling from a towery height.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Odyssey_(Pope)/Book_XI#:~:text=To%20hell%20my%20doom%20I%20owe%2C%0ADemons%20accursed%2C%20dire%20ministers%20of%20woe!%0AMy%20feet%2C%20through%20wine%20unfaithful%20to%20their%20weight%2C%0ABetray%27d%20me%20tumbling%20from%20a%20towery%20height">Pope</a> (1725)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Fool’d by some dæmon and the intemp’rate bowl.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.gutenberg.org/files/24269/24269-h/24269-h.htm#BOOK_XI:~:text=Fool%E2%80%99d%20by%20some,house%20of%20Circe">Cowper</a> (1792), ll. 69-70]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab">I died<br>
By stroke of fate and the dread fumes of wine.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/The_Odyssey_of_Homer/7-Eh5oFk6msC?hl=en&gbpv=1&pg=PA258">Worsley</a> (1861), st. 9]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Ill fate destroyed me, and unstinted wine!<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/A_Nearly_Literal_Translation_of_Homer_s/44YXAAAAYAAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&bsq=%22unstinted%20wine%22">Bigge-Wither</a> (1869)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>An evil doom of some god was my bane, and wine out of measure.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.gutenberg.org/files/1728/1728-h/1728-h.htm#chap11:~:text=an%20evil%20doom%20of%20some%20god%20was%20my%20bane%20and%20wine%20out%20of%20measure.">Butcher/Lang</a> (1879)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>God's doom and wine unstinted on me the bane hath brought.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/The_Odyssey_of_Homer/VwcOAAAAYAAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&bsq=%22wine%20unstinted%22">Morris</a> (1887)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Heaven's cruel doom destroyed me, and excess of wine.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/Odyssey/KYlBAQAAMAAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&bsq=%22excess%20of%20wine%22">Palmer</a> (1891)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>It was all bad luck, and my own unspeakable drunkenness.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/The_Odyssey_(Butler)/Book_XI#:~:text=%27it%20was%20all%20bad%20luck%2C%20and%20my%20own%20unspeakable%20drunkenness">Butler</a> (1898)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>It was all bad luck of a <em>daimôn</em>, and my own unspeakable drunkenness.<br>
[tr. Butler (1898), rev. <a href="http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus%3Atext%3A1999.01.0218%3Abook%3D11%3Acard%3D1#:~:text=%E2%80%98it%20was%20all%20bad%20luck%20of%20a%20daim%C3%B4n%2C%20and%20my%20own%20unspeakable%20drunkenness.">Power/Nagy</a> (1900)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>It was all bad luck of a superhuman force <em>[daimōn],</em> and my own unspeakable drunkenness.<br>
[tr. Butler (1898), rev. <a href="https://chs.harvard.edu/primary-source/homeric-odyssey-sb/#11t:~:text=it%20was%20all%20bad%20luck%20of%20a%20superhuman%20force%20%5Bdaim%C5%8Dn%5D%2C%20and%20my%20own%20unspeakable%20drunkenness.">Kim/McCray/Nagy/Power</a> (2018)]</blockquote><br>



<blockquote>The harsh burden of some God sealed my doom, together with my own unspeakable excess in wine.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/The_Odyssey/qhQAywOYz10C?hl=en&gbpv=1&bsq=%22harsh%20verdict%22">Lawrence</a> (1932)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>It was the malice of some evil power that was my undoing, and all the wine I swilled before I went to sleep in Circe’s palace.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/stream/TheOdyssey/TheOdyssey_djvu.txt#:~:text=it%20was%20the%20malice%20of%20some%20%0Aevil%20power%20that%20was%20my%20undoing%2C%20and%20all%20the%20wine%20I%20swilled%20%0Abefore%20I%20went%20to%20sleep%20in%20Circe%E2%80%99s%20palace.">Rieu</a> (1946)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Bad luck shadowed me, and no kindly power;<br>
ignoble death I drank with so much wine.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/odysseyerni00home/page/186/mode/2up?q=%22bad+luck+shadowed%22">Fitzgerald</a> (1961)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>The evil will of the spirit and the wild wine bewildered me.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/odysseyofhomerha00rich/page/168/mode/2up?q=%22wild+wine+bewildered%22">Lattimore</a> (1965)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab">My undoing lay<br>
in some god sending down my dismal fate<br>
and in too much sweet wine.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/The_Odyssey_of_Homer/ORyo8qAA-CQC?hl=en&gbpv=1&kptab=overview&bsq=%22my%20undoing%20lay%22">Mandelbaum</a> (1990)]</blockquote><br>



<blockquote>The doom of an angry god, and god knows how much wine --<br>
they were my ruin, captain.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/odyssey0000home_i6h2/page/178/mode/2up?q=%22god+knows+how+much+wine%22">Fagles</a> (1996)]</blockquote><br>



<blockquote>Bad luck and too much wine undid me.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/essentialodyssey0000home/page/96/mode/2up?q=%22too+much+wine%22">Lombardo</a> (2000)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>The malicious decree of some god and too much wine were my undoing.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/The_Odyssey/U2Jovv1NuMsC?gbpv=1&bsq=%22maliciouis%20decree%22">DCH Rieu</a> (2002)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>It was a god-sent evil destiny that ruined me, and too much wine.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/The_Odyssey/o8dLDQAAQBAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&bsq=%22destiny%20that%20ruined%22">Verity</a> (2016)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>But I had bad luck from some god, and too much wine befuddled me.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/The_Odyssey/PpJYDgAAQBAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&bsq=%22but%20i%20had%20bad%20luck%22">Wilson</a> (2017)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Some god's ill-will undid me -- that, and too much wine!<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/The_Odyssey/BUFJDwAAQBAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&bsq=%22some%20god%27s%20ill-will%22">Green</a> (2018)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab"><span class="tab">Some fatal deity<br>
has brought me down -- that and too much wine.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://johnstoniatexts.x10host.com/homer/odyssey11html.html#:~:text=some%20fatal%20deity%0Ahas%20brought%20me%20down%E2%80%94that%20and%20too%20much%20wine.">Johnston</a> (2019)]</blockquote><br>
						</span>
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                <!-- DCH Modify the title to give the category (quote author) at the beginning of it. -->
		<title>Cicero, Marcus Tullius -- De Senectute [Cato Maior; On Old Age], ch. 13 / sec. 44 (13.44) (44 BC) [tr. Shuckburgh (1895)]</title>
		<link>https://wist.info/cicero-marcus-tullius/64706/</link>
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		<pubDate>Fri, 17 Nov 2023 20:54:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Cicero, Marcus Tullius]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[blessing]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[desire]]></category>
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		<category><![CDATA[moderation]]></category>
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		<description><![CDATA[Why then do I spend so many words on the subject of pleasure? Why, because, far from being a charge against old age, that it does not much feel the want of any pleasures, it is its highest praise. But, you will say, it is deprived of the pleasures of the table, the heaped up [&#8230;]]]></description>
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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Why then do I spend so many words on the subject of pleasure? Why, because, far from being a charge against old age, that it does not much feel the want of any pleasures, it is its highest praise. But, you will say, it is deprived of the pleasures of the table, the heaped up board, the rapid passing of the wine-cup. Well, then, it is also free from headache, disordered digestion, broken sleep. But if we must grant pleasure something, since we do not find it easy to resist its charms, &#8212; for Plato, with happy inspiration, calls pleasure &#8220;vice&#8217;s bait,&#8221; because of course men are caught by it as fish by a hook, &#8212; yet, although old age has to abstain from extravagant banquets, it is still capable of enjoying modest festivities.<br />
&nbsp;<br />
<em>[Quorsum igitur tam multa de voluptate? Quia non modo vituperatio nulla, sed etiam summa laus senectutis est, quod ea voluptates nullas magno opere desiderat. Caret epulis exstructisque mensis et frequentibus poculis. Caret ergo etiam vinulentia et cruditate et insomniis. Sed si aliquid dandum est voluptati, quoniam eius blanditiis non facile obsistimus, divine enim Plato “escam malorum” appellat voluptatem quod ea videlicet homines capiantur ut pisces, quamquam immoderatis epulis caret senectus, modicis tamen conviviis delectari potest.]</em></p>
<br><b>Marcus Tullius Cicero</b> (106-43 BC) Roman orator, statesman, philosopher<br><i>De Senectute [Cato Maior; On Old Age]</i>, ch. 13 / sec. 44 (13.44) (44 BC) [tr. Shuckburgh (1895)] 
									<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;(<a href="https://www.gutenberg.org/cache/epub/2808/pg2808-images.html#:~:text=Why%20then%20do,enjoying%20modest%20festivities." target="_blank">Source</a>)
										<br><br><span class="cite">
						

The reference to Plato is to <i>Timaeus</i>, 69D: "κακοῦ δέλεαρ".<br><br>

(<a href="http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus%3Atext%3A2007.01.0038%3Asection%3D44#:~:text=quorsum%20igitur%20tam,delectari%20potest.">Source (Latin)</a>). Alternate translations:<br><br>

<blockquote>Therfor thene ye may aske and demaunde why I haue said so many thynges of flesshely delyte and of lecherye, wherfor I answere you that the blame and the shame is not onely ynoughe. But namely it is the grete lawde and praysyng of olde age that it desyreth but lytle flesshely delectacyons. Olde age chargith nevir of dyetes nor of dyvers deynty metys nor of tables richely and dyversly arrayde nor of many dyners drynkys. Olde age wille not be fulle of wyn often for doubte of sekenes. Olde age wille not suffre the akyng of the bely as is the colyk or of the stone or costyfnes whiche comyth of takyng so muche mete and so often that it abideth rawe within the stomake. Olde age desyrith not wakyng in the tyme that nature hath ordeyned to slepe. Albeit an aged man is gretly disposed to wake ayenst his will forsoth the philosopher Platon whiche spake dyversly in a mater that delectacyon at∣tempted by euill disposed men that leyen the baite & the snare to delite aged men in repleccion of lustis & metys not helefull to them  & bycause that men be taken & decevued by the baite sett in the hoke or angle as the bird is taken in the snare how be it that olde age wolde have no metys ne his etyngys excessiuely. Algatys they may delite in deynte metys and in smale feedyngys and temperate dyete.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://quod.lib.umich.edu/e/eebo/A69111.0001.001?rgn=main;view=fulltext#:~:text=Therfor%20the%CC%84ne%20ye,and%20temperate%20dyete%20/">Worcester/Worcester/Scrope</a> (1481)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>But to what purpose do we speak so much of pleasure? Verily, to the intent that hereby it may be seen and proved, how that it cannot only not be objected to old age for any vituperation and dispraise, but rather for a singular praise and commendation; because old-age doth not esteem nor care for these pleasures. But some other will say: It lacketh sumptuous fare, costly dishes, delicate viands, and drinks of all sorts. Hereto I answer tihat, therefore, it lacketh also drunkenness, crudity, or indigestion, fantastical dreams, and ridiculous apparitions. But if we must any whit yield to to pleasure because we cannot easily resist the blandishments and allurements thereof (for the divine philosopher Plato calleth pleasure the bait of all mischief, because men therewith are caught and snared even as fishes are with the hook), I say, that although old age be not endangered nor given to superfluous and immoderate banqueting, and at unseasonable hours, yet in temperate and moderate feasting it may be solaced and comfortably recreated.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/cicerosbooksfri00harrgoog/page/n134/mode/2up?q=%22speak+so+much+of+pleasure%22">Newton</a> (1569)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>But to what end speak we so much of pleasure? because that you may see that no blame, but much praise is to be given to age, because it doth not lust after pleasure, which is so dangerous a thing. Age wanteth banquetting, gluttony, and quaffing; it is also without surfeting, drunkennesse, or dreaming; but yet if we may any wayes take some pleasure, because we do not easily resist her flatteries (for divine Plato calleth pleasure the bait of evils, because men are caught ther∣with as fishes with a hook) tho age despiseth immoderate banquets, yet may it be delighted with moderate meetings.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://quod.lib.umich.edu/e/eebo/A33149.0001.001?rgn=main;view=fulltext#:~:text=But%20to%20what%20end%20speak,delighted%20with%20mo%E2%88%A3derate%20meetings.">Austin</a> (1648), ch. 12-13]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Then to our age (when not to pleasures bent)<br>
<span class="tab">This seems an honour, not disparagement.<br>
We, not all pleasures like the Stoicks hate;<br>
<span class="tab">But love and seek those which are moderate.<br>
(Though Divine Plato thus of pleasures thought,<br>
<span class="tab">They us, with hooks and baits, like fishes caught.)<br>
[tr. <a href="https://quod.lib.umich.edu/e/eebo2/B21163.0001.001?rgn=main;view=fulltext#:~:text=Then%20to%20our,like%20fishes%20caught.)">Denham</a> (1669)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>I have dwelt the longer on this Topick of bodily Pleasures, to shew, it is so far from being a Disparagement to our Age, to be deprived of these Enjoyments, that it is its greatest Praise and Commendation, that it even takes off our Inclinations from the violent Pursuit of them. Though we may not indulge our selves so freely in our Cups, though we do not relish the Pleasures of the most luxurious Provisions, will not our being freed from the fatal Consequences of Indigestion, and a disordered Imagination, make us ample amends? But if we must make some Allowances for Pleasure, and submit to its Blandishments (which Plato calls the Bait of humane Miseries, with which like Fishes we are tempted to the Hook). Though we are deprived of the Pleasure of immoderate Feasting, yet can we still relish the Charms of an agreeable and chearful Entertainment; which arises not from the Delicacy or Variety of Courses, but from the Conversation of the Company.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/Cicero_on_Old_Age_a_Dialogue/-DVcAAAAQAAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&bsq=plato">Hemming</a> (1716)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>And why all this of Pleasure? Because not only to over-rule the Objection, but to shew that it is the greatest Encomium on Old Age, that he never ardently desires what we call Pleasure. Doth Age want Banquets, great Tables, and frequent Use of Wine? Confequently it is free from Drunkenness, Surfeits, and watchful Nights. But if we are any ways to give ourselves up to Pleasure, because we cannot altogether attend her Invitations, as Plato says, who calls it "a Bait for Evil, and that Men are taken with it as Fishes with a Hook," yet Old Age will abstain from Revelling, and take Delight only in moderate Entertainments.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/Cato_Major_Or_Marcus_Tullius_Cicero_s_Tr/dehhAAAAcAAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&bsq=%22what%20have%20i%22">J. D.</a> (1744)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Thus I judged it necessary to be the more full on this Head of Pleasure, and shew the Dangers of it, to the end you might clearly see, it is so far from being a Disadvantage to Old-Age, its Palling our Inclinations to Pleasure, that on the contrary it is rather a great and valuable Blessing. For if it is in a good Measure dead to the Enjoyments others find in Banqueting, sumptuous Feasts and Carousings, it is freed at the same time from all the troublesome Effects of these; as Fumes, Crudities, uneasy Sleep, or the want of it; with divers other such like Disorders. Yet as Nature has so ordered it, that Pleasure should have a very strong Hold of us, and the Inclination to it appears deeply founded in our very Composition, (and 'tis with too much Justice that the divine Plato calls it the Bait of Evil, by which Men are caught as Fish with a Hook) therefore, though Age is not taken, nor can well bear, with those splendid sumptuous Feastings and Revels, yet we are not so insensible to the Pleasures of Life, but that we can indulge ourselves, and take a real Delight in sober and temperate Entertainments with our Friends.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://quod.lib.umich.edu/cgi/t/text/text-idx?cc=evans;c=evans;idno=N04335.0001.001;node=N04335.0001.001:5.13;seq=1;rgn=div2;view=text#:~:text=Thus%20I%20judged,with%20our%20Friends.">Logan</a> (1744)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>I have dwelt the longer upon this article, in order to convince you, that the little relish which old age leaves us for enjoyments of the sensual kind, is so far from being a just imputation on this period of life, that on the contrary it very considerably raises its value. If age render us incapable of taking an equal share in the flowing cups, and luxuriant dishes of splendid tables, it secures us too from their unhappy consequences -- from painful indigestions, restless nights, and disordered reason. Accordingly, the divine Plato justly represents pleasure as the bait by which vice ensnares and captivates her deluded votaries. But if this enticement cannot always be resisted, if the palate must sometimes be indulged, I do not scruple to say that an old man, although his years will guard him from excess, is by no means excluded from enjoying, in a moderate degree, the convivial gratifications.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/oldageandfriends00ciceuoft/page/54/mode/2up?q=%22dwelt+the+longer%22">Melmoth</a> (1773)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>With what view then do I say so much about pleasure? Because not only is it no ground of censure, but even the highest praise of old age, that it desires no pleasures very much. But is old age without feasts, and loaded tables, and frequent cups? Therefore it is without drunkenness, and indigestion and troubled sleep. But if something must be given to pleasure, since we do not easily withstand its blandishments, (for divinely Plato calls pleasure the bait of evils, because evidently men are taken by it as fishes by a hook,) though old age is debarred immoderate feasts, yet, it may be gratified with temperate socialities.<br>
[<a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/Cicero_on_Old_Age_Literally_Translated_E/OKb5knapj7IC?hl=en&gbpv=1&bsq=%22what%20view%20then%22">Cornish Bros.</a> ed. (1847)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>To what end then have I said so many things about pleasure? Because it is so far from being any disparagement, that it is even the highest praise to old age, that it has no great desire for any pleasures. It lacks banquets, and piled up boards, and fast-coming goblets; it is therefore also free from drunkenness and indigestion and sleeplessness. But if something must be conceded to pleasure (since we do not easily withstand its allurements, for Plato beautifully calls pleasure the bait of evils, inasmuch as, by it, in fact, men are caught as fishes with a hook), although old age has nothing to do with extravagant banquets, yet in reasonable entertainments it can experience pleasure.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/cicerosthreeboo00cice/page/236/mode/2up?q=%22to+what+end+then%22">Edmonds</a> (1874)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>But to what purpose am I saying so much about pleasure? Because it is not only no reproach to old age, but even its highest merit, that it does not severely feel the loss of bodily pleasures. But, you may say, it must dispense with sumptuous feasts, and loaded tables, and oft-drained cups. True, but it equally dispenses with sottishness, and indigestion, and troubled dreams. But if any license is to be given to pleasure, seeing that we do not easily resist its allurements, -- insomuch that Plato calls pleasure the bait of evil, because, forsooth, men are caught by it as fishes by the hook, -- old age, while it dispenses with excessive feasting, yet can find delight in moderate conviviality.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Cicero_de_Senectute/Text#:~:text=But%20to%20what,in%20moderate%20conviviality.">Peabody</a> (1884)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>But why so much of pleasure? Why, you see, <br>
Not only is it no disgrace to age, <br>
But ev'n its greatest merit that it longs <br>
No more for pleasure, cares no more for feasts <br>
With loaded tables and o'er-flowing wine. <br>
It misses too the headache, and the night <br>
Of sickness and of sleeplessness that comes. <br>
If something we must grant to pleasure's claim: <br>
(It is not easy to resist its charm: <br>
The godlike Plato thinks it is a bait <br>
To catch the foolish, just as fish are caught:) <br>
Though we cannot indulge in gorgeous feasts, <br>
A modest dinner we can still enjoy.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=coo1.ark:/13960/t70v9281n&view=2up&seq=46&q1=plato">Allison</a> (1916)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Why then, do I dwell at such length on pleasure? Because the fact that old age feels little longing for sensual pleasures not only is no cause for reproach, but rather is ground for the highest praise. Old age lacks the heavy banquet, the loaded table, and the oft-filled cup; therefore it also lacks drunkenness, indigestion, and loss of sleep. But if some concession must be made to pleasure, since her allurements are difficult to resist, and she is, as Plato happily says, “the bait of sin,” -- evidently because men are caught therewith like fish -- then I admit that old age, though it lacks immoderate banquets, may find delight in temperate repasts.<br>
[tr. <a href="http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus%3Atext%3A2007.01.0039%3Asection%3D44#:~:text=Why%20then%2C%20do,in%20temperate%20repasts.">Falconer</a> (1923)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Why then do I have so much to say about pleasures of this kind? Because the weakening of temptation to indulge in them, far from supplying a pretext to reproach old age, is a reason for offering it the most cordial complements. Age has no banquets, no tables piled high, no cups filled again and again. So it avoids drunkenness, and indigestion, and sleepless nights! However, the allurements of pleasure are admittedly hard to resist; they are "the bait of sin," as Plato brilliantly calls them, which catch men like fish. If, then, we have to make them some concession, there is no reason why old age, though spared extravagant feasting, should not gratify itself with entertainments of a more modest nature.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/Selected_Works_Cicero_Marcus_Tullius/7g1OF04FoW8C?hl=en&gbpv=1&bsq=%22pleasures%20of%20this%20kind%22">Grant</a> (1960, 1971 ed.)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Why am I dwelling at such length on pleasure? Because it is not only no condemnation of old age, but rather its highest recommendation, that it feels no overwhelming desire for pleasure. The old do not share in banquets, in tables piled high with food, and in endless toasts; as a consequence, they do not share in drunkenness, in indigestion, and in sleeplessness. But if we must make some concession to pleasure, since we do not easily resist its blandishments (in a moment of inspiration Plato called pleasure “the bait of evil” -- obviously because men are caught by it like fish) -- even though the old do not share in unrestrained high life, still they can derive pleasure from moderate conviviality.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/onoldageonfriend0000unse/page/22/mode/2up?q=%22why+am+i+dwelling%22">Copley</a> (1967)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Why do I go on so much about pleasure? As old men, we should not so much resent our age as praise it in the most glowing terms, because now we cannot feel any more interest in sensual temptations. As old men, we no longer attend formal banquets at tables loaded down with delicious food and wine; but on the other hand we no longer suffer from hangovers and indigestion and insomnia. But even so it may be hard to resist temptation completely. Plato cleverly referred to pleasure as “sin-bait,” because men are caught by it like fishes. There is, then, in our old age, nothing wrong with spending a convivial evening with friends, although we will not indulge ourselves to excess.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/redflareciceroso0000cice/page/34/mode/2up?q=%22why+do+i+go+on%22">Cobbold</a> (2012)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>So why am I going on and on about pleasure? Because I want to impress upon you how the fact that old age is less subject to the passions for pleasure is not an indictment of this stage of life, but actually one of its greatest advantages. If it lacks allnight parties, or tables heaped hy with rich food and powerful dirnk, it also lacks drunkenness, indigestion, insomnia, and "the morning after." It is not that old age lacks pleasures, it is that they change. And they are healthier. Gone are the overindulgent feasts and in their place we take pleasure in delightful dinner parties.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/How_To_Be_Old/OREcBAAAQBAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&bsq=%22[44]%22">Gerberding</a> (2014)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>So why do I tarry on pleasure’s enticement?<br>
The fact that old age has no longing for it<br>
<span class="tab">Not only can’t be taken as a demerit,<br>
<span class="tab">But on the contrary is the best of credits.<br>
<span class="tab">Freedom from decked tables, from banquets<br>
And also from frequent potations<br>
Means freedom from drunkenness,<br>
<span class="tab">From insomnia and indigestions.<br>
<span class="tab">But we’re bound to make some concessions<br>
To better resist pleasure’s alluring snares<br>
<span class="tab">Which Plato calls the bait of transgressions,<br>
<span class="tab">By which like fish men are caught unawares.<br>
Although old age sumptuous banquets must shun<br>
<span class="tab">In light repasts it finds indeed some fun.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.crtpesaro.it/Materiali/Latino/De%20Senectute.php#:~:text=So%20why%20do,indeed%20some%20fun.">Bozzi</a> (2015)]</blockquote><br>
						</span>
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		<title>Bierce, Ambrose -- &#8220;Bacchus,&#8221; The Cynic&#8217;s Word Book (1906)</title>
		<link>https://wist.info/bierce-ambrose/64479/</link>
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		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Nov 2023 23:28:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Bierce, Ambrose]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[alcohol]]></category>
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		<description><![CDATA[BACCHUS, n. A convenient deity invented by the ancients as an excuse for getting drunk. Included in The Devil&#8217;s Dictionary (1911). Originally published in the &#8220;Devil&#8217;s Dictionary&#8221; column in the San Francisco Wasp (1881-04-23).]]></description>
        <!-- DCH Insert author info (category description) then (Source) and then put the extra info (MORE) below that. -->
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>BACCHUS, <i>n.</i> A convenient deity invented by the ancients as an excuse for getting drunk.</p>
<br><b>Ambrose Bierce</b> (1842-1914?) American writer and journalist<br>&#8220;Bacchus,&#8221; <i>The Cynic&#8217;s Word Book</i> (1906) 
									<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;(<a href="https://www.gutenberg.org/files/43951/43951-h/43951-h.htm#link2H_4_0003:~:text=BACCHUS%2C%20w.%20A%20convenient%20deity%20invented%20by%20the%20ancients%20as%20an%20excuse%20for%20getting%20drunk." target="_blank">Source</a>)
										<br><br><span class="cite">
						

<a href="https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/The_Devil%27s_Dictionary/B#:~:text=BACCHUS%2C%20n.%20A%20convenient%20deity%20invented%20by%20the%20ancients%20as%20an%20excuse%20for%20getting%20drunk.">Included</a> in <i>The Devil's Dictionary</i> (1911). <a href="https://archive.org/details/unabridgeddevils00bier/page/352/mode/2up?q=%22Bacchus+Bachelor+Back%22">Originally published</a> in the "Devil's Dictionary" column in the San Francisco <i>Wasp</i> (1881-04-23).						</span>
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		<title>Wilde, Oscar -- Letter to Robert Ross (c. 1898-05-28)</title>
		<link>https://wist.info/wilde-oscar/63802/</link>
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		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Oct 2023 23:18:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Wilde, Oscar]]></category>
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		<description><![CDATA[After all, the only proper intoxication is conversation.]]></description>
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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>After all, the only proper intoxication is conversation. </p>
<br><b>Oscar Wilde</b> (1854-1900) Irish poet, wit, dramatist<br>Letter to Robert Ross (c. 1898-05-28) 
									<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;(<a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/OSCAR_WILDE_Premium_Collection/oK3oDwAAQBAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&dq=wilde+%22proper+intoxication+is+conversation%22&pg=PT2888&printsec=frontcover" target="_blank">Source</a>)
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		<title>Bengis, Ingrid -- &#8220;Monroe According to Mailer: One Legend Feeds on Another,&#8221; Ms. (1973-10)</title>
		<link>https://wist.info/bengis-ingrid/61121/</link>
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		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Jun 2023 16:27:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Bengis, Ingrid]]></category>
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		<description><![CDATA[There are plenty of alcoholics who can be magnificent when drunk: it does not make them any less alcoholic. Reprinted in Michael Lennon, ed., Critical Essays on Norman Mailer (1986).]]></description>
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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There are plenty of alcoholics who can be magnificent when drunk: it does not make them any less alcoholic.</p>
<br><b>Ingrid Bengis</b> (1944-2017) American writer, business person<br>&#8220;Monroe According to Mailer: One Legend Feeds on Another,&#8221; <i>Ms.</i> (1973-10) 
									<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;(<a href="https://archive.org/details/criticalessayson0000unse_l2b7/page/74/mode/2up?q=%22magnificent%22" target="_blank">Source</a>)
										<br><br><span class="cite">
						

Reprinted in Michael Lennon, ed., <i>Critical Essays on Norman Mailer</i> (1986).						</span>
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		<title>Muller, Marcia -- Edwin of the Iron Shoes, ch. 7 (1977)</title>
		<link>https://wist.info/muller-marcia/60982/</link>
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		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Jun 2023 21:58:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Muller, Marcia]]></category>
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		<description><![CDATA[When I stepped through the door, the sharp odor of gin hit me. Charlie was drowning his sorrows, and they apparently were dying hard.]]></description>
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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>When I stepped through the door, the sharp odor of gin hit me. Charlie was drowning his sorrows, and they apparently were dying hard.</p>
<br><b>Marcia Muller</b> (b. 1944) American author <br><i>Edwin of the Iron Shoes</i>, ch. 7 (1977) 
									<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;(<a href="https://archive.org/details/edwinofironshoes00mull/page/52/mode/2up?q=%22Charlie+was+drowning%22" target="_blank">Source</a>)
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		<title>Martial -- Epigrams [Epigrammata], Book  1, epigram  27 (1.27) (AD 85-86) [tr. Nixon (1911), &#8220;A Alleybi&#8217;s the Thing&#8221;]</title>
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		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Feb 2023 18:53:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Martial]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[companion]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[drinking]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[drunkenness]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[invitation]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[memory]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[regret]]></category>

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		<description><![CDATA[The fact I asked you last night To come round this evening and dine, Procillus, would seem to be due To that fifth or sixth bottle of wine. To think it entirely arranged And take notes on the nonsense you hear Is a hazardous way to behave &#8212; D&#8211;n a drinker whose memory&#8217;s clear! [Hesterna [&#8230;]]]></description>
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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The fact I asked you last night<br />
<span class="tab">To come round this evening and dine,<br />
Procillus, would seem to be due<br />
<span class="tab">To that fifth or sixth bottle of wine.<br />
To think it entirely arranged<br />
<span class="tab">And take notes on the nonsense you hear<br />
Is a hazardous way to behave &#8212;<br />
<span class="tab">D&#8211;n a drinker whose memory&#8217;s clear!</p>
<p><em>[Hesterna tibi nocte dixeramus,<br />
Quincunces puto post decem peractos,<br />
Cenares hodie, Procille, mecum.<br />
Tu factam tibi rem statim putasti<br />
Et non sobria verba subnotasti<br />
Exemplo nimium periculoso:<br />
Μισῶ μνάμονα συμπόταν, Procille.]</em></span></span></span></span></p>
<br><b>Martial</b> (AD c.39-c.103) Spanish Roman poet, satirist, epigrammatist [Marcus Valerius Martialis]<br><i>Epigrams [Epigrammata]</i>, Book  1, epigram  27 (1.27) (AD 85-86) [tr. Nixon (1911), &#8220;A Alleybi&#8217;s the Thing&#8221;] 
									<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;(<a href="https://archive.org/details/romanwitepigrams00mart/page/8/mode/2up?q=procillus" target="_blank">Source</a>)
										<br><br><span class="cite">
						

"To Procillus." The Greek phrase, attested to elsewhere in Classical literature, reads, as variously translated here, "I dislike a drinking companion who remembers."  <br><br>

(<a href="http://data.perseus.org/citations/urn:cts:latinLit:phi1294.phi002.perseus-lat1:1.27">Source (Latin)</a>). Alternate translations:<br><br>

<blockquote>I had this day carroust the thirteenth cup,<br>
And was both slipper-tong'd, and idle-brain'd,<br>
And said by chance, that you with me should sup.<br>
<span class="tab">You thought hereby, a supper cleerely gain'd:<br>
And in your Tables you did quote it up.<br>
Uncivill ghest, that hath been so ill train'd!<br>
Worthy thou are hence supperlesse to walke,<br>
<span class="tab">That tak'st advantage of our Table-talke.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/The_Epigrams_of_Sir_John_Harington/hZ03AAAAIAAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&bsq=%22thirteenth%20cup%22">Harington</a> (fl. c. 1600)] </blockquote><br>

<blockquote>To sup with me, to thee I did propound,<br>
<span class="tab">But 'twas when our full cups had oft gone round.<br>
The thing thou straight concludest to be done,<br>
<span class="tab">Merry and sober words counting all one.<br>
Th' example's dangerous at the highest rate;<br>
<span class="tab">A memorative drunkard all men hate.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/The_Epigrams_of_Martial/LzXgAAAAMAAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&bsq=%22bohn%27s%20classical%20library%22">Killigrew</a> (1695)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Yesternight, it seems, I swore,<br>
<span class="tab">Fifty bumpers hardly o'er,<br>
You should sup tonight with me;<br>
<span class="tab">Instant you devour'd the glee;<br>
And would bind the words of drink:<br>
<span class="tab">Dang'rous precedent, I think.<br>
Wofull partner of the bowl,<br>
<span class="tab">Proves a reminiscent soul.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/The_Epigrams_of_M_Val_Martial/vksOAAAAQAAJ?gbpv=1">Elphinston</a> (1782), Book 7, ep. 17]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Last night I had invited you -- after some fifty glasses, I suppose, had been despatched -- to sup with me today. You immediately thought your fortune was made, and took note of my unsober words, with a precedent but too dangerous. I hate a boon companion whose memory is good, Procillus.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.tertullian.org/fathers/martial_epigrams_book01.htm#:~:text=Last%20night%20I%20had%20invited%20you%2D%2D%2D%2Dafter%20some%20fifty%20glasses%2C%20I%20suppose%2C%20had%20been%20despatched%2D%2D%2D%2Dto%20sup%20with%20me%20to%2Dday.%20You%20immediately%20thought%20your%20fortune%20was%20made%2C%20and%20took%20note%20of%20my%20unsober%20words%2C%20with%20a%20precedent%20but%20too%20dangerous.%20I%20hate%20a%20boon%20companion%20whose%20memory%20is%20good%2C%20Procillus.">Bohn's Classical</a> (1859)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Last night I said to you (I think it was after I had got through ten half-pints): "Dine with me today, Procillus."  You at once thought the matter settled for you, and took secret note of my unsober remark -- a precedent too dangerous! "I hate a messmate with a memory," Procillus.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/Epigrams/w4ZfAAAAMAAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&bsq=%22walter%22">Ker</a> (1919)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>I may have asked you here to dine,<br>
But that was late at night,<br>
And none of us had spared the wine<br>
<span class="tab">If I remember right.<br>
You thought the invitation meant,<br>
Though wine obscured my wit!<br>
And -- O most parous precedent --<br>
<span class="tab">You made a note of it!<br>
The maxim that in Greece was true<br>
Is true in Rome today --<br>
"I hate a fellow-toper who<br>
<span class="tab">Remembers what I say."<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/martialtwelveboo0000tran/page/n31/mode/2up?q=%22wise+to+forget%22">Pott & Wright</a> (1921), "'Tis Wise to Forget"]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>After ten cups were put away<br>
<span class="tab">I said, "Procillus," yesterday,<br>
"You'll dine with me, my friend, you're wanted."<br>
<span class="tab">You promptly took the thing for granted<br>
And made a note without formality<br>
<span class="tab">Of my incautious hospitality;<br>
A dangerous precedent to set;<br>
<span class="tab">I hate a guest who won't forget.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/Martial_s_Epigrams/g35fAAAAMAAJ?gbpv=1&bsq=%22after%20ten%20cups%22">Francis & Tatum</a> (1924), #16]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Last night I said, while feeling fine,<br>
<span class="tab">Having drunk much too much wine,<br>
That you must promise, when this way,<br>
<span class="tab">To stop and dine with me some day.<br>
You made a mental note of it,<br>
<span class="tab">A practice which, I must admit --<br>
Taking me at my drunken word! --<br>
<span class="tab">Is dangerous and quite absurds.<br>
Barroom promises are fine,<br>
<span class="tab">But he who keeps them is a swine!<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/martialselectede0000unse/page/8/mode/2up?q=%22while+feeling+fine%22">Marcellino</a> (1968)]</blockquote><br>



<blockquote>Last night in my cups,<br>
or my brandy tumbler, at least,<br>
I asked you for dinner today.<br>
But you took me seriously, Procillus,<br>
and noted down carefully the words I spouted<br>
under the influence. A dangerous business.<br>
I don't like to drink with people who remember.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/epigramsofmartia0000mart_q2h6/page/48/mode/2up?q=%22in+my+cups%22">Bovie</a> (1970)]</blockquote><br>




<blockquote>Last night, after five pints of wine,<br>
<span class="tab">I said, "Procillus, come and dine<br>
Tomorrow." You assumed I meant<br>
<span class="tab">What I said (a dangerous precedent)<br>
And slyly jotted down a note<br>
<span class="tab">Of my drunk offer. Let me quote<br>
A proverb from the Greek: "I hate<br>
<span class="tab">An unforgetful drinking mate."<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/epigrams0000mart/page/4/mode/2up?q=%22five+pints%22">Michie</a> (1972)] </blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Last night when I was carried off with wine<br>
<span class="tab">I made you promise to drop by and dine<br>
With me today. Only a fool or a turd<br>
<span class="tab">Expects a drunken man to keep his word.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/martialinenglish00mart/page/386/mode/2up?q=%22bummer%22">O'Connell</a> (1991), "Bummer"]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Last night after getting through four pints or so I asked you to dine with me this evening, Procillus. You thought you had the matter settled then and there, and made a mental note of my tipsy words -- a very dangerous precedent. I don't like a boozing partner with a memory, Procillus.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://dokumen.pub/martial-epigrams-spectacles-books-1-5-1-0674995554-9780674995550.html#:~:text=Last%20night%20after%20getting%20through%20four%20pints%20or%20so%20I%20asked%20you%20to%20dine%20with%20me%20this%20evening%2C%20Procillus.%20You%20thought%20you%20had%20the%20matter%20settled%20then%20and%20there%2C%20and%20made%20a%20mental%20note%20of%20my%20tipsy%20wordsa%20very%20dangerous%20precedent.%20I%20don%27t%20like%20a%20boozingpartner%20with%20a%20memory%2C%20d%20Procillus.">Shackleton Bailey</a> (1993)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>When drinks I had beyond my number,<br>
<span class="tab">I thought I would myself encumber<br>
With a pledge to give you lunch today.<br>
<span class="tab">You wrote it down with great display<br>
As if to register disputed votes.<br>
<span class="tab">I hate a tippler taking notes.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/Martial_s_Epigrams/13X80r3_zQIC?hl=en&gbpv=1&printsec=frontcover&bsq=%221.27%22">Wills</a> (2007)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Last night, Procillus, after I had drunk<br>
four pints or so, I asked if you would dine<br>
with me today. At once, you thought the matter<br>
was settled, based on statements blurred by wine --<br>
a risky precedent. Good memory<br>
is odious in one who drinks with me.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/selectedepigrams0000mart_b6d3/page/4/mode/2up?q=procillus">McLean</a> (2014)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Last night I invited you,<br>
after we killed, what, fifty-something cups,<br>
to come and eat some food with me today.<br>
Right then and there you thought the thing was done<br>
and took me at my not-so-sober word.<br>
A very risky thing to do: <em>I hate<br>
a drinking bud whose memory is good.</em><br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.trickdogbar.com/gypsytan/wp-content/uploads/2022/07/Trick-Dog-Menu.pdf">Goldman</a> (2022)]</blockquote><br>						</span>
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		<title>Euripides -- Bacchæ [Βάκχαι], l.  260ff [Pentheus/Πενθεύς] (405 BC) [tr. Arrowsmith (1960)]</title>
		<link>https://wist.info/euripides/58605/</link>
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		<pubDate>Tue, 31 Jan 2023 15:32:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Euripides]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[alcohol]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[drunkenness]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[misogyny]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[orgies]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[religion]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[sexism]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[wine]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[women]]></category>

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		<description><![CDATA[When once you see the glint of wine shining at the feasts of women, then you may be sure the festival is rotten. [γυναιξὶ γὰρ ὅπου βότρυος ἐν δαιτὶ γίγνεται γάνος, οὐχ ὑγιὲς οὐδὲν ἔτι λέγω τῶν ὀργίων.] (Source (Greek)). Alternate translations: For when women Share at their feasts the grape&#8217;s bewitching juice; From their [&#8230;]]]></description>
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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>When once you see<br />
the glint of wine shining at the feasts of women,<br />
then you may be sure the festival is rotten. </p>
<p>[γυναιξὶ γὰρ<br />
ὅπου βότρυος ἐν δαιτὶ γίγνεται γάνος,<br />
οὐχ ὑγιὲς οὐδὲν ἔτι λέγω τῶν ὀργίων.]</p>
<br><b>Euripides</b> (485?-406? BC) Greek tragic dramatist<br><i>Bacchæ</i> [Βάκχαι], l.  260ff [Pentheus/Πενθεύς] (405 BC) [tr. Arrowsmith (1960)] 
									<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;(<a href="https://classics.domains.skidmore.edu/lit-campus-only/primary/translations/Euripides%20Bac.pdf" target="_blank">Source</a>)
										<br><br><span class="cite">
						

(<a href="https://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus%3Atext%3A1999.01.0091%3Acard%3D215#:~:text=%CE%B3%CF%85%CE%BD%CE%B1%CE%B9%CE%BE%E1%BD%B6%20%CE%B3%E1%BD%B0%CF%81%0A%E1%BD%85%CF%80%CE%BF%CF%85%20%CE%B2%CF%8C%CF%84%CF%81%CF%85%CE%BF%CF%82%20%E1%BC%90%CE%BD%20%CE%B4%CE%B1%CE%B9%CF%84%E1%BD%B6%20%CE%B3%CE%AF%CE%B3%CE%BD%CE%B5%CF%84%CE%B1%CE%B9%20%CE%B3%CE%AC%CE%BD%CE%BF%CF%82%2C%0A%CE%BF%E1%BD%90%CF%87%20%E1%BD%91%CE%B3%CE%B9%E1%BD%B2%CF%82%20%CE%BF%E1%BD%90%CE%B4%E1%BD%B2%CE%BD%20%E1%BC%94%CF%84%CE%B9%20%CE%BB%CE%AD%CE%B3%CF%89%20%CF%84%E1%BF%B6%CE%BD%20%E1%BD%80%CF%81%CE%B3%CE%AF%CF%89%CE%BD.">Source (Greek)</a>). Alternate translations:<br><br>

<blockquote>For when women<br>
Share at their feasts the grape's bewitching juice; <br>
From their licentious orgies, I pronounce<br>
No good results.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/nineteentragedi00wodhgoog/page/358/mode/2up?q=%22for+when+women%22">Wodhull</a> (1809)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>For where women have the delight of the grape-cluster at a feast, I say that none of their rites is healthy any longer.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus%3Atext%3A1999.01.0092%3Acard%3D215#:~:text=For%20where%20women%20have%20the%20delight%20of%20the%20grape%2Dcluster%20at%20a%20feast%2C%20I%20say%20that%20none%20of%20their%20rites%20is%20healthy%20any%20longer.">Buckley</a> (1850)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>For where ’mong women <br>
The grape’s sweet poison mingles with the feast, <br>
Nought holy may we augur of such worship.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/bacchae0000euri_x9h8/page/10/mode/2up?q=%22for+where+mong%22">Milman</a> (1865)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>When women drain the wine-cup at the feast,<br>
Foul is the orgie, dangerous the disease.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/bacchaerogers00euri/page/12/mode/2up?q=%22when+women+drain%22">Rogers</a> (1872)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>For where the gladsome grape is found at women’s feasts, I deny that their rites have any longer good results.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/The_Plays_of_Euripides_(Coleridge)/The_Bacchantes#:~:text=for%20where%20the%20gladsome%20grape%20is%20found%20at%20women%E2%80%99s%20feasts%2C%20I%20deny%20that%20their%20rites%20have%20any%20longer%20good%20results.">Coleridge</a> (1891)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>For when<br>
In women's feasts the cluster's pride hath part,<br>
No good, say I, comes of their revelry.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Tragedies_of_Euripides_(Way)/The_Bacchanals#cite_ref-6:~:text=for%20when,of%20their%20revelry.">Way</a> (1898)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>When once the gleam<br>
Of grapes hath lit a Woman's Festival,<br>
In all their prayers is no more health at all!<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.gutenberg.org/cache/epub/35173/pg35173-images.html#:~:text=When%20once%20the%20gleam%0AOf%20grapes%20hath%20lit%20a%20Woman%27s%20Festival%2C%0AIn%20all%20their%20prayers%20is%20no%20more%20health%20at%20all!">Murray</a> (1902)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>For where women<br>
have the sparkle of the vine in their festivities,<br>
there, I say, nothing wholesome remains in their rituals.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/bacchae0000euri_w7z7/page/48/mode/2up?q=%22for+where+women%22">Kirk</a> (1970)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>As for women, my opinion is this: when the sparkle of sweet wine appears at their feasts, no good can be expected from their ceremonies.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/bacchae0000phil/page/188/mode/2up?q=%22as+for+women%22">Vellacott</a> (1973)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>I tell you, when women <br>
have the cluster’s refreshment at banquets,<br>
there’s nothing healthy left about their orgies.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20070928000447/http://pages.sbcglobal.net/mattneub/downloads/bacchae.pdf">Neuburg</a> (1988)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Take my word,<br>
when women are allowed to fast on wine, there is no<br>
telling to what lengths their filthy minds will go!<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/bacchae0000euri_p3f3/page/16/mode/2up?q=%22Take+my+word%22">Cacoyannis</a> (1982)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>I say that feast where a woman takes <br>
The gleaming grape is most diseased.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/bacchae0000euri_h0w4/page/10/mode/2up?q=%22I+say+that+feast%22">Blessington</a> (1993)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>For whenever the liquid joy<br>
of the grape comes into women's festivals, then, I assure, you,<br>
there's nothing wholesome in their rites.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/bacchaeofeuripid0000euri/page/34/mode/2up?q=%22liquid+joy%22">Esposito</a> (1998)] </blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Because when women<br>
get their sparkle at a feast from wine,<br>
I say the entire ritual is corrupt.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/bacchae0000euri_s0g4/page/10/mode/2up?q=%22because+when+women%22">Woodruff</a> (1999)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>For when the women have <br>
The bright grape-cluster gleaming at their feasts, <br>
There’s nothing healthy in these rites, I say.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/bacchaeotherplay0000euri_p0i4/page/254/mode/2up?q=%22for+when+the+women%22">Gibbons/Segal</a> (2000)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Wherever women get the gleaming grape to drink in their feasts, everything about their rites is diseased.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/bacchaeiphigenia00euri/page/34/mode/2up">Kovacs</a> (2002)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>I’m telling you both, no good comes out of drunk women.<br>
Wine wisdom and orgies are dangerous.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://bacchicstage.wordpress.com/euripides/bacchae/#:~:text=I%E2%80%99m%20telling%20you%20both%2C%20no%20good%20comes%20out%20of%20drunk%20women.%0AWine%20wisdom%20and%20orgies%20are%20dangerous.">Theodoridis</a> (2005)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>For whenever the pleasure of the grape's<br>
cluster comes shimmering to women in feast, I say no-<br>
thing is left wholesome in their orgies!<br>
[tr. <a href="https://euripidesofathens.blogspot.com/2008/01/scene-1.html#:~:text=for%20whenever%20the%20pleasure%20of%20the%20grape%27s%0Acluster%20comes%20shimmering%20to%20women%20in%20feast%2C%20I%20say%20no%2D%0Athing%20is%20left%20wholesome%20in%20they%27re%20orgies!">Valerie</a> (2005)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Whenever women at some banquet start to take pleasure in the gleaming wine, I say there's nothing healthy in their worship.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/Bacchae/o4JeCg6u18oC?hl=en&gbpv=1&printsec=frontcover&bsq=%22whenever%20women%22">Johnston</a> (2008)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>It's always the same: as soon as you allow drink and women at a festival, everything gets sordid.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/bacchae0000euri_p3z6/page/16/mode/2up?q=%22always+the+same%22">Robertson</a> (2014)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>When <i>women</i> start getting into the wine, I say it’s gone too far. It’s not healthy.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://the-mercurian.com/2019/12/13/the-bacchae/#:~:text=When%20women%20start%20getting%20into%20the%20wine%2C%20I%20say%20it%E2%80%99s%20gone%20too%20far.%20It%E2%80%99s%20not%20healthy.">Pauly</a> (2019)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>There is no good in these festivals where shimmering wine corrupts women.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/The_Bacchae_of_Euripides/UmCTDwAAQBAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&bsq=%22shimmering%20wine%22&printsec=frontcover">Behr/Foster</a> (2019)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>For where women have the delight of the grape at a feast, I say that none of their rites is healthy any longer.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://chs.harvard.edu/primary-source/euripides-bacchae-sb/#:~:text=For%20where%20women%20have%20the%20delight%20of%20the%20grape%20at%20a%20feast%2C%20I%20say%20that%20none%20of%20their%20rites%20is%20healthy%20any%20longer.">Buckley/Sens/Nagy</a> (2020)]</blockquote><br>						</span>
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                <!-- DCH Modify the title to give the category (quote author) at the beginning of it. -->
		<title>Homer -- The Odyssey [Ὀδύσσεια], Book 14, l. 462ff (14.462) [Odysseus] (c. 700 BC) [tr. DCH Rieu (2002)]</title>
		<link>https://wist.info/homer/47790/</link>
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		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Jul 2021 22:26:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Homer]]></category>
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		<description><![CDATA[Listen to me, Eumaeus and all of you. I am going to boast and tell you a story. This is the effect of wine &#8212; it makes people do crazy things; it sets the wisest man singing and giggling stupidly; it lures him on to dance and it makes him blurt out what&#8217;s better left [&#8230;]]]></description>
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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Listen to me, Eumaeus and all of you.<br />
I am going to boast and tell you a story. This is the effect of wine &#8212;<br />
it makes people do crazy things; it sets the wisest man<br />
singing and giggling stupidly; it lures him on to dance<br />
and it makes him blurt out what&#8217;s better left unsaid.</p>
<p>[κέκλυθι νῦν, Εὔμαιε καὶ ἄλλοι πάντες ἑταῖροι,<br />
εὐξάμενός τι ἔπος ἐρέω: οἶνος γὰρ ἀνώγει<br />
ἠλεός, ὅς τ᾽ ἐφέηκε πολύφρονά περ μάλ᾽ ἀεῖσαι<br />
καί θ᾽ ἁπαλὸν γελάσαι, καί τ᾽ ὀρχήσασθαι ἀνῆκε,<br />
καί τι ἔπος προέηκεν ὅ περ τ᾽ ἄρρητον ἄμεινον.]</p>
<br><b>Homer</b> (fl. 7th-8th C. BC) Greek author<br><i>The Odyssey</i> [Ὀδύσσεια], Book 14, l. 462ff (14.462) [Odysseus] (c. 700 BC) [tr. DCH Rieu (2002)] 
									<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;(<a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/The_Odyssey/U2Jovv1NuMsC?hl=en&gbpv=1&pg=PT3&printsec=frontcover&bsq=listen%20going%20to%20boast" target="_blank">Source</a>)
										<br><br><span class="cite">
						

(<a href="http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus%3Atext%3A1999.01.0135%3Abook%3D14%3Acard%3D446#:~:text=%CE%BA%CE%AD%CE%BA%CE%BB%CF%85%CE%B8%CE%B9%20%CE%BD%E1%BF%A6%CE%BD%2C%20%CE%95%E1%BD%94%CE%BC%CE%B1%CE%B9%CE%B5,%CF%84%E1%BE%BD%20%E1%BC%84%CF%81%CF%81%CE%B7%CF%84%CE%BF%CE%BD%20%E1%BC%84%CE%BC%CE%B5%CE%B9%CE%BD%CE%BF%CE%BD.">Source (Greek)</a>). Alternate translations:<br><br>

<blockquote>Hear me, Eumæus, and my other friends,<br>
I’ll use a speech that to my glory tends,<br>
Since I have drunk wine past my usual guise.<br>
<i>Strong wine commands the fool and moves the wise,</i><br>
Moves and impels him too to sing and dance,<br>
And break in pleasant laughters, and, perchance,<br>
Prefer a speech too that were better in.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.gutenberg.org/files/48895/48895-h/48895-h.htm#:~:text=I%E2%80%99ll%20use%20a,th%E2%80%99%20Ilion%20tow%E2%80%99rs!">Chapman</a> (1616)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Hear me, Eumæus, says he, and you folk,<br>
I have a tale to tell. This foolish wine<br>
To laugh and dance is able to provoke<br>
Grave men sometimes that have no such design,<br>
And to speak that which better were unspoke.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://oll.libertyfund.org/title/hobbes-the-english-works-vol-x-iliad-and-odyssey#:~:text=Hear%20me%2C%20Eum%C3%A6us,better%20were%20unspoke.">Hobbes</a> (1675), l. 448ff]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Hear me, my friends! who this good banquet grace;<br>
'Tis sweet to play the fool in time and place,<br>
And wine can of their wits the wise beguile,<br>
Make the sage frolic, and the serious smile,<br>
The grave in merry measures frisk about,<br>
And many a long-repented word bring out.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Odyssey_(Pope)/Book_XIV#:~:text=Hear%20me%2C%20my,yoke%20of%20sense.">Pope</a> (1725)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Hear now, Eumæus, and ye other swains<br>
His fellow-lab’rers! I shall somewhat boast,<br>
By wine befool’d, which forces ev’n the wise<br>
To carol loud, to titter and to dance,<br>
And words to utter, oft, better suppress’d.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.gutenberg.org/files/24269/24269-h/24269-h.htm#:~:text=I%20shall%20somewhat,oft%2C%20better%20suppress%E2%80%99d.">Cowper</a> (1792), l. 567ff]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Hear now, Eumæus, and thy comrades all!<br>
I speak for glory, since by wine made bold<br>
Often to singing even the wise will fall,<br>
Light laughter and the dance, nor can withhold<br>
Words that in sooth were better far untold.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/The_Odyssey_tr_into_Engl_verse_by_P_S_Wo/TYMCAAAAQAAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&dq=odyssey%20worsley&pg=PA44&printsec=frontcover&bsq=%22speak%20for%20glory%22">Worsley</a> (1861), st. 59]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Hear, now, the words,<br>
Eumaeus! and all you who with him serve!<br>
To which, although to vaunt I may appear,<br>
I must give utt'rance; for that crazing wine<br>
Has set me on, which oft the wisest man <br>
Ere now hat stirr'd up into noisy song,<br>
or into burst of friv'lous laughter thrown,<br>
Nay, even rous'd to dancing, or some speech<br>
Impulsive prompted, which 'twere better far<br>
Had ne'er been utter'd.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/The_Odyssey_of_Homer/GcQzAQAAMAAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&bsq=%22vaunt%20I%20may%20appear%22">Musgrave</a> (1869), l. 772ff]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Now list! Eumæus! and ye comrades all!<br>
I'll glory somewhat in the tale I'll tell you;<br>
For crazy wine urges me on to speak,<br>
Which e'en a sage hat set to noisy singing;<br>
And urged the shy to laughter loud and dancing;<br>
And uttered words far better left unsaid!<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/A_Nearly_Literal_Translation_of_Homer_s/44YXAAAAYAAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&pg=PA248&printsec=frontcover&bsq=%22glory%20somewhat%22">Bigge-Wither</a> (1869)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Listen now, Eumaeus, and all of you his companions, with a prayer will I utter my word; so bids me witless wine, which drives even the wisest to sing and to laugh softly, and rouses him to dance, yea and makes him to speak out a word which were better unspoken.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.gutenberg.org/files/1728/1728-h/1728-h.htm#:~:text=Listen%20now%2C%20Eumaeus%2C%20and%20all%20of%20you%20his%20companions%2C%20with%20a%20prayer%20will%20I%20utter%20my%20word%3B%20so%20bids%20me%20witless%20wine%2C%20which%20drives%20even%20the%20wisest%20to%20sing%20and%20to%20laugh%20softly%2C%20and%20rouses%20him%20to%20dance%2C%20yea%20and%20makes%20him%20to%20speak%20out%20a%20word%20which%20were%20better%20unspoken.">Butcher/Lang</a> (1879)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Now hearken ye, Eumæus, and all our fellows here,<br>
And a boasting word will I say; for befooling wine is strong<br>
Within me: he who eggeth e'en the wise to raise the song<br>
And laugh out softly, and dance for very lustihead,<br>
And to say the word, it may be, that were better left unsaid.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/The_Odyssey_of_Homer/VwcOAAAAYAAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&pg=PA263&printsec=frontcover&bsq=%22boasting%20word%22">Morris</a> (1887)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Hearken, Eumaeus, and all you other men, and I will boast a bit and tell a story; for crazy wine so bids, which sets a man, even if wise, to skinging loud and laughing lightly, and makes him dance and brings out stories really better left untold.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/Odyssey/KYlBAQAAMAAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&pg=PA227&printsec=frontcover&bsq=%22crazy%20wine%20so%20bids%22">Palmer</a> (1891)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Listen to me, Eumæus and the rest of you; when I have said a prayer I will tell you something. It is the wine that makes me talk in this way; wine will make even a wise man fall to singing; it will make him chuckle and dance and say many a word that he had better leave unspoken<br>
[tr. <a href="https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/The_Odyssey_(Butler)/Book_XIV#:~:text=Listen%20to%20me%2C%22%20said%20he%2C%20%22Eum%C3%A6us%20and%20the%20rest%20of%20you%3B%20when%20I%20have%20said%20a%20prayer%20I%20will%20tell%20you%20something.%20It%20is%20the%20wine%20that%20makes%20me%20talk%20in%20this%20way%3B%20wine%20will%20make%20even%20a%20wise%20man%20fall%20to%20singing%3B%20it%20will%20make%20him%20chuckle%20and%20dance%20and%20say%20many%20a%20word%20that%20he%20had%20better%20leave%20unspoken">Butler</a> (1898)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Listen to me now, Eumaios and all you other companions <em>[hetairoi]!</em> Speaking proudly, I will tell you a wording <em>[epos]</em>. The wine, which sets me loose, is telling me to do so. Wine impels even the thinking man to sing and to laugh softly. And it urges him on to dance. It even prompts an epos that may be better left unsaid.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://chs.harvard.edu/primary-source/homeric-odyssey-sb/#:~:text=Listen%20to%20me%20now,better%20left%20unsaid.%20467">Butler</a> (1898), rev. Kim/McCray/Nagy/Power (2018)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Hear me now, Eumaeus and all the rest of you, his men, with a wish in my heart will I tell a tale; for the wine bids me, befooling wine, which sets one, even though he be right wise, to singing and laughing softly, and makes him stand up and dance, aye, and brings forth a word which were better unspoken.<br>
[tr. <a href="http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus%3Atext%3A1999.01.0136%3Abook%3D14%3Acard%3D446#:~:text=Hear%20me%20now,were%20better%20unspoken.">Murray</a> (1919)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Hear me now, O Eumaeus and you others, while I let myself go as your wine's intoxication tempts me. Drink will set the most solid man singing or giggling with laughter; if indeed it does not push him forward to dance or make him blurt out something better left unsaid.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/The_Odyssey/qhQAywOYz10C?hl=en&gbpv=1&pg=PP1&printsec=frontcover&bsq=%22drink%20will%20set%22">Lawrence</a> (1932)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Listen to me, Eumaeus and you men of his. I am going to put a wish of mine into the form of a story. This is the effect of your wine -- for wine is a crazy thing. It sets the wisest man singing and giggling like a girl; it lures him on to dance and it makes him blurt out what were better left unsaid.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/stream/TheOdyssey/TheOdyssey_djvu.txt#:~:text=Listen%20to%20me%2C%E2%80%99%20he,were%20better%20left%20unsaid.">Rieu</a> (1946)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Eumaios, and you others, here's a wishful <br>
tale I shall tell. The wine's behind it,<br>
vaporing wine, that makes a serious man<br>
break down and sing, kick up his heels and clown,<br>
or tell some story that were best untold.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/The_Odyssey/bafQVqR6O5kC?hl=en&gbpv=1&pg=PT302&printsec=frontcover&bsq=%22vaporing%20wine%22">Fitzgerald</a> (1961)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Hear me now, Eumaios and all you other companions. <br>
What I say will be a bit of boasting. The mad wine tells me <br>
to do it. Wine sets even a thoughtful man to singing, <br>
or sets him into softly laughing, sets him to dancing. <br>
Sometimes it tosses out a word that was better unspoken. <br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/stream/hmril/The%20Odyssey%20of%20Homer%2C%20translated%20by%20Richmond%20Lattimore_djvu.txt#:~:text=Hear%20me%20now%2C%20Eumaios%20and%20all%20you%20other%20companions.%20%0AWhat%20I%20say%20will%20be%20a%20bit%20of%20boasting.%20The%20mad%20wine%20tells%20%0Ame%20%0A%0A%0A%0Ato%20do%20it.%20Wine%20sets%20even%20a%20thoughtful%20man%20to%20singing%2C%20%0A%0A465%20or%20sets%20him%20into%20softly%20laughing%2C%20sets%20him%20to%20dancing.%20%0ASometimes%20it%20tosses%20out%20a%20word%20that%20was%20better%20%0Aunspoken.">Lattimore</a> (1965)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Listen, Eumaeus, and all you comrades here,<br>
allow me to sing my praises for a moment.<br>
Say it's the wine that leads me on, the wild wine<br>
that sets the wisest man to sing at the top of his lungs,<br>
laugh like a fool -- it drives the man to dancing ... it even<br>
tempts him to blurt out stories better never told.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.boyle.kyschools.us/UserFiles/88/The%20Odyssey.pdf">Fagles</a> (1996)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Hear me now, Eumaeus, and the rest of you men,<br>
While I boast a little. It must be the wine<br>
Befuddling me, which gets even sensible men<br>
Singing and laughing and up to dance,<br>
And sometimes say things better left unsaid.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/Odyssey/yIFAC9r4NW0C?hl=en&gbpv=1&pg=PA219&printsec=frontcover&bsq=%22it%20must%20be%20the%20wine%22">Lombardo</a> (2000), l. 500ff]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Eumaeus and you others, all of you, I want to brag a little. I am dizzy, under the influence fo wine, which makes even the wisest people sing and giggle, and dance, and say things best not spoken.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/The_Odyssey/PpJYDgAAQBAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&pg=PT5&printsec=frontcover&bsq=%22eumaeus%20and%20you%20others%22">Wilson</a> (2017), l. 461ff]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Hear me out now, Eumaios, and you, all his other comrades, while I tell you a boastful story. It's the wine that's urging me -- mind-crazing stuff, that sets on even the quick-witted to singing and gentle laughter, drives him to get up and dance, or make some remark better left unspoken.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/The_Odyssey/BUFJDwAAQBAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&pg=PR6&printsec=frontcover&bsq=gentle%20laughter">Green</a> (2018)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Eumaeus and you others, his work mates,<br>
hear me now -- I wish to tell a story,<br>
prompted by this wine, which addles our wits.<br>
Wine can make a man, even though he’s wise,<br>
sing out loud, or laugh softly to himself,<br>
or leap up and dance. It can bring out words<br>
which were better left unspoken.<br>
[tr. <a href="http://johnstoniatexts.x10host.com/homer/odyssey14html.html#:~:text=Eumaeus%20and%20you%20others%2C%20his%20work%20mates">Johnston</a> (2019), l. 601ff]</blockquote><br>						</span>
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		<title>Cicero, Marcus Tullius -- Pro Murena, ch. 6, sec. 13 (63 BC)</title>
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		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Sep 2020 16:49:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Cicero, Marcus Tullius]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[dancing]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[drunkenness]]></category>
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		<description><![CDATA[Almost no one dances sober, unless he is insane. [Nemo enim fere saltat sobrius, nisi forte insanit, neque in solitudine neque in convivio moderato atque honesto.] More completely, &#8220;For no man, one may almost say, ever dances when sober, unless perhaps he be a madman, nor in solitude, nor in a moderate and sober party.&#8221; [&#8230;]]]></description>
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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Almost no one dances sober, unless he is insane.</p>
<p><em>[Nemo enim fere saltat sobrius, nisi forte insanit, neque in solitudine neque in convivio moderato atque honesto.]</em></p>
<br><b>Marcus Tullius Cicero</b> (106-43 BC) Roman orator, statesman, philosopher<br><i>Pro Murena</i>, ch. 6, sec. 13 (63 BC) 
									<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;(<a href="http://data.perseus.org/citations/urn:cts:latinLit:phi0474.phi014.perseus-lat1:6.13" target="_blank">Source</a>)
										<br><br><span class="cite">
						

More completely, "For no man, one may almost say, ever dances when sober, unless perhaps he be a madman, nor in solitude, nor in a moderate and sober party." [tr. Yonge].<br><br>

Often shortened to "Nemo saltat sobrius" ("Nobody dances sober"). Also attributed to H. P. Lovecraft.<br><br>

<a href="https://history.stackexchange.com/questions/3152/no-sane-man-will-dance-when-where-about-what-did-cicero-say-this">In context</a>, Cicero is disputing accusations that L. Murena was dancing because there are no reports that Murena was drinking and carousing beforehand.





						</span>
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		<title>Hemingway, Ernest -- (Attributed)</title>
		<link>https://wist.info/hemingway-ernest/42996/</link>
		<comments>https://wist.info/hemingway-ernest/42996/#respond</comments>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Aug 2020 21:24:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Hemingway, Ernest]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[commitment]]></category>
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		<description><![CDATA[Always do sober what you said you would do drunk. That will teach you to keep your mouth shut.]]></description>
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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Always do sober what you said you would do drunk. That will teach you to keep your mouth shut.</p>
<br><b>Ernest Hemingway</b> (1899-1961) American writer<br>(Attributed) 
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		<title>Aristophanes -- Knights, ll. 90-96 [tr. Rogers (1924)]</title>
		<link>https://wist.info/aristophanes/41807/</link>
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		<pubDate>Wed, 20 May 2020 15:47:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
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		<description><![CDATA[DEMOSTHENES: And dare you rail at wine&#8217;s inventiveness? I tell you nothing has such go as wine. Why, look you now; &#8217;tis when men drink, they thrive, Grow wealthy, speed their business, win their suits, Make themselves happy, benefit their friends. Go, fetch me out a stoup of wine, and let me Moisten my wits, [&#8230;]]]></description>
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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>DEMOSTHENES: And dare you rail at wine&#8217;s inventiveness?<br />
I tell you nothing has such go as wine.<br />
Why, look you now; &#8217;tis when men drink, they thrive,<br />
Grow wealthy, speed their business, win their suits,<br />
Make themselves happy, benefit their friends.<br />
Go, fetch me out a stoup of wine, and let me<br />
Moisten my wits, and utter something bright.</p>
<br><b>Aristophanes</b> (c. 450-c. 388 BC) Athenian comedic playwright<br><i>Knights</i>, ll. 90-96 [tr. Rogers (1924)] 
									<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;(<a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/Aristophanes/qIyEAAAAIAAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&pg=PA133&printsec=frontcover&bsq=%22dare%20you%20rail%22" target="_blank">Source</a>)
										<br><br><span class="cite">
						

Alt. trans.<ul>
	<li> [<a href="http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text.jsp?doc=Aristoph.+Kn.+90">O'Neill</a> (1938)]: "Do you dare to accuse wine of clouding the reason? Quote me more marvellous effects than those of wine. Look! when a man drinks, he is rich, everything he touches succeeds, he gains lawsuits, is happy and helps his friends. Come, bring hither quick a flagon of wine, that I may soak my brain and get an ingenious idea."</li>
	<li>[<a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/The_comedies_of_Aristophanes_a_literal_t/ddUIAAAAQAAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&dq=%22comedies%20of%20aristophanes%22%20hickie&pg=PA57&printsec=frontcover&bsq=%22audacity%20to%20abuse%22">Hickie</a> (1853)]: "Have you the audacity to abuse wine for witlessness? Can you find anything more business-like than wine? Do you see? when men drink, then they are rich, they transact business, gain causes, are happy, assist their friends. Come, bring me out quickly a stoup of wine, that I may moisten my intellect, and say something clever."</li>
</ul>						</span>
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		<title>Conrad, Barnaby III -- &#8220;Martini Madness,&#8221; Cigar Aficionado (Spring 1996)</title>
		<link>https://wist.info/conrad-barnaby-iii/37957/</link>
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		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Sep 2017 21:21:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
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		<description><![CDATA[A word of caution to neophyte Martini drinkers: When taken to excess, this perfectly civilized drink can lead directly to uncivilized behavior. &#8230; The purpose of the Martini is to enhance the evening, not to obliterate it.]]></description>
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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A word of caution to neophyte Martini drinkers: When taken to excess, this perfectly civilized drink can lead directly to uncivilized behavior. &#8230; The purpose of the Martini is to enhance the evening, not to obliterate it. </p>
<br><b>Barnaby Conrad III</b> (b. 1952) American author, artist, editor<br>&#8220;Martini Madness,&#8221; <i>Cigar Aficionado</i> (Spring 1996) 
									<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;(<a href="http://www.cigaraficionado.com/webfeatures/show?id=Martini-Madness_7630" target="_blank">Source</a>)
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		<title>Jong, Erica -- Seducing the Demon: Writing for My Life, ch. 2 (2006)</title>
		<link>https://wist.info/jong-erica/37237/</link>
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		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Jun 2017 14:50:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
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		<description><![CDATA[I often think of alcohol as a genie in a bottle. It promises everything but eventually imprisons you in the bottle itself.]]></description>
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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I often think of alcohol as a genie in a bottle. It promises everything but eventually imprisons you in the bottle itself. </p>
<br><b>Erica Jong</b> (b. 1942) American writer, poet<br><i>Seducing the Demon: Writing for My Life</i>, ch. 2 (2006) 
									<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;(<a href="https://books.google.com/books?id=-qWirxcS1m0C&lpg=PP1&dq=jong%20%22seducing%20the%20demon%22&pg=PA134#v=onepage&q=genie&f=false" target="_blank">Source</a>)
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		<title>Bible, Vol. 1. Old Testament -- Book 20. Proverbs 20: 1 (Prov 20:1) [KJV (1611)]</title>
		<link>https://wist.info/bible-ot/37126/</link>
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		<pubDate>Wed, 31 May 2017 17:17:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Bible, Vol. 1. Old Testament]]></category>
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		<description><![CDATA[Wine is a mocker, strong drink is raging: and whosoever is deceived thereby is not wise. Alternate translations: Wine is a luxurious thing, and drunkenness riotous: whosoever is delighted therewith shall not be wise. [DRA (1899)] Wine is reckless, strong drink quarrelsome; unwise is he whom it seduces. [JB (1966)] Drinking too much makes you [&#8230;]]]></description>
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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wine is a mocker, strong drink is raging: and whosoever is deceived thereby is not wise.</p>
<br><b>The Bible (The Old Testament)</b> (14th - 2nd C BC) Judeo-Christian sacred scripture [Tanakh, Hebrew Bible], incl. the Apocrypha (Deuterocanonicals) <br>Book 20. <i>Proverbs</i> 20: 1 (Prov 20:1) [KJV (1611)] 
									<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;(<a href="https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=proverbs+20%3A1&version=KJV" target="_blank">Source</a>)
										<br><br><span class="cite">
						

Alternate translations:<br><br>

<blockquote>Wine is a luxurious thing, and drunkenness riotous: whosoever is delighted therewith shall not be wise.<br>
[<a href="https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=proverbs+20%3A1&version=DRA">DRA</a> (1899)] </blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Wine is reckless, strong drink quarrelsome; unwise is he whom it seduces.<br>
[<a href="https://bibledoctrine.us/proverbs/#:~:text=Wine%20is%20reckless%2C%20strong%20drink%20quarrelsome%3B%20unwise%20is%20he%20whom%20it%20seduces.">JB</a> (1966)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Drinking too much makes you loud and foolish. It's stupid to get drunk.<br>
[<a href="https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=proverbs+20%3A1&version=GNT">GNT</a> (1976)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Wine is reckless, liquor rowdy; unwise is anyone whom it seduces.<br>
[<a href="https://www.bibliacatolica.com.br/en/new-jerusalem-bible/proverbs/20/#:~:text=Wine%20is%20reckless%2C%20liquor%20rowdy%3B%20unwise%20is%20anyone%20whom%20it%20seduces.">NJB</a> (1985)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Wine is a mocker; beer a carouser.<br>
<span class="tab">Those it leads astray won’t become wise.<br>
[<a href="https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=proverbs+20%3A1&version=CEB">CEB</a> (2011)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Wine is a mocker and beer a brawler;<br>
<span class="tab">whoever is led astray by them is not wise.<br>
[<a href="https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=proverbs+20%3A1&version=NIV">NIV</a> (2011 ed.)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Wine is a mocker, strong drink a brawler,<br>
<span class="tab">and whoever is led astray by it is not wise.<br>
[<a href="https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=proverbs+20%3A1&version=NRSVUE">NRSV</a> (2021 ed.)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>Wine is a scoffer, strong drink a roisterer;<br>
No one who is muddled by them will ever grow wise.<br>
[<a href="https://www.sefaria.org/Proverbs.20.1?lang=bi&with=all&lang2=en">RJPS</a> (2023 ed.)]</blockquote><br>
						</span>
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		<title>Brust, Steven -- The Phoenix Guards (1991)</title>
		<link>https://wist.info/brust-steven/35653/</link>
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		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Nov 2016 06:15:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
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		<description><![CDATA[It remains true, however, that an inconveniently placed railing or sharp corner will not remove itself from the path of a drunkard, even if that drunkard is unaware of the obstacles on the path he has set for himself; in other words, no matter to what degree we are oblivious to the world, it makes [&#8230;]]]></description>
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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It remains true, however, that an inconveniently placed railing or sharp corner will not remove itself from the path of a drunkard, even if that drunkard is unaware of the obstacles on the path he has set for himself; in other words, no matter to what degree we are oblivious to the world, it makes its own choices as to how oblivious it will be to us.</p>
<br><b>Steven Brust</b> (b. 1955) American writer, systems programmer<br><i>The Phoenix Guards</i> (1991) 
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		<title>Parker, Dorothy -- (Spurious)</title>
		<link>https://wist.info/parker-dorothy/21458/</link>
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		<pubDate>Fri, 21 Jun 2013 14:37:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
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		<description><![CDATA[I like to have a martini, Two at the very most. After three I&#8217;m under the table, After four I&#8217;m under my host. Variants: &#8220;I&#8217;d love to have a martini, / Two at the very most. / With three I&#8217;m under the table, / With four I&#8217;m under my host.&#8221; &#8220;I like to have a [&#8230;]]]></description>
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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I like to have a martini,<br />
Two at the very most.<br />
After three I&#8217;m under the table,<br />
After four I&#8217;m under my host.</p>
<br><b>Dorothy Parker</b> (1893-1967) American writer, poet, wit<br>(Spurious) 
														<br><br><span class="cite">
						

Variants:<ul>
	<li>"I'd love to have a martini, / Two at the very most. / With three I'm under the table, / With four I'm under my host."</li>
	<li>"I like to have a Martini / But only two at the most, /  After three I'm under the table, / After four I'm under my host."</li>
</ul>Frequently attributed to Parker (the main quatrain quoted is in <em>The Collected Dorothy Parker</em>), but originally an anonymous gag in <a href="https://books.google.com/books?id=zdFKAAAAYAAJ&q=%22under+the+table%22+%22under+the+host%22&dq=%22under+the+table%22+%22under+the+host%22&hl=en&sa=X&ei=BAZjUcHjI4200QH67YDwCQ&ved=0CD4Q6AEwAjgU">found</a>  in the University of Virginia <em>Harlequin</em> (1959): "I wish I could drink like a lady. / 'Two or three,' at the most. / But two, and I'm under the table -- / And three, I'm under the host."<br><br>

The confusion apparently comes from Bennett Cerf, <i>Try and Stop Me</i> (1944), where he related an anecdote in which Parker commented about a cocktail party, more straightforwardly, "Enjoyed it? One more drink and I'd have been under the host!" See <a href="http://www.slate.com/articles/life/drink/features/2013/martini_madness_tournament/sweet_16/dorothy_parker_martini_poem_why_the_attribution_is_spurious.html">here</a> for more discussion.


						</span>
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		<title>Byron, George Gordon, Lord -- The Deformed Transformed, Part 3, sc. 1 [Caesar] (1822)</title>
		<link>https://wist.info/byron/20904/</link>
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		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Apr 2013 12:41:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
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		<description><![CDATA[He drinks &#8212; but what&#8217;s drinking? A mere pause from thinking! Singing of veterans after the war, in peacetime.]]></description>
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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>He drinks &#8212; but what&#8217;s drinking?<br />
A mere pause from thinking!</p>
<br><b>George Gordon, Lord Byron</b> (1788-1824) English poet<br><i>The Deformed Transformed</i>, Part 3, sc. 1 [Caesar] (1822) 
									<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;(<a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/The_deformed_transformed_a_drama/PwgUAAAAQAAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&bsq=%22mere%20pause%22" target="_blank">Source</a>)
										<br><br><span class="cite">
						

Singing of veterans after the war, in peacetime.						</span>
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		<title>Hugo, Victor -- Les Misérables, Part 2 &#8220;Cosette,&#8221; Book  6 &#8220;Petite Picpus,&#8221; ch.  9 (2.6.9) (1862) [tr. Wilbour (1862)]</title>
		<link>https://wist.info/hugo-victor/13572/</link>
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		<pubDate>Mon, 17 Jan 2011 13:50:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
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		<description><![CDATA[Upon the first goblet he read this inscription, monkey wine; upon the second, lion wine; upon the third, sheep wine; upon the fourth, swine wine. These four inscriptions expressed the four descending degrees of drunkenness: the first, that which enlivens; the second, that which irritates; the third, that which stupefies; finally the last, that which [&#8230;]]]></description>
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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Upon the first goblet he read this inscription, <em>monkey wine;</em> upon the second, <em>lion wine;</em> upon the third, <em>sheep wine;</em> upon the fourth, <em>swine wine</em>.   These four inscriptions expressed the four descending degrees of drunkenness: the first, that which enlivens; the second, that which irritates; the third, that which stupefies; finally the last, that which brutalizes.<br />
&nbsp;<br />
<em>[Sur le premier gobelet on lisait cette inscription: vin de singe, sur le deuxième: vin de lion, sur le troisième: vin de mouton, sur le  quatrième: vin de cochon. Ces quatre légendes exprimaient les quatre  degrés que descend l’ivrogne; la première ivresse, celle qui égaye; la deuxième, celle qui irrite; la troisième, celle qui hébète; la dernière enfin, celle qui abrutit.]</em></p>
<br><b>Victor Hugo</b> (1802-1885) French writer<br><i>Les Misérables</i>, Part 2 &#8220;Cosette,&#8221; Book  6 &#8220;Petite Picpus,&#8221; ch.  9 (2.6.9) (1862) [tr. Wilbour (1862)] 
									<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;(<a href="https://archive.org/details/in.ernet.dli.2015.43835/page/n437/mode/2up?q=%22first+goblet%22" target="_blank">Source</a>)
										<br><br><span class="cite">
						

An anecdote told by a century-old nun about filled wine goblets customarily presented, before the Revolution, by city fathers to important personages who passed through in Burgandy or Champagne.<br><br>

(<a href="https://fr.wikisource.org/wiki/Les_Mis%C3%A9rables/Tome_2/Livre_6/09#:~:text=Sur%20le%20premier,celle%20qui%20abrutit.">Source (French)</a>). Alternate translations:<br><br>

<blockquote>On the the first cup was the inscription “ape-wine,” on the second, “lion-wine,” on the third, “sheep-wine,” and on the fourth, “hog-wine.” These four mottoes expressed the four stages of intoxication—the first that enlightens, the second that irritates, the third that dulls, and the fourth that brutalizes.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/lesmiserables0000vict_z1p0/page/n531/mode/2up?q=%22lion-wine%22">Wraxall</a> (1862)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>On the first goblet this inscription could be read, monkey wine; on the second, lion wine; on the third, sheep wine; on the fourth, hog wine. These four legends express the four stages descended by the drunkard; the first, intoxication, which enlivens; the second, that which irritates; the third, that which dulls; and the fourth, that which brutalizes.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Les_Mis%C3%A9rables/Volume_2/Book_Sixth/Chapter_9#:~:text=On%20the%20first,that%20which%20brutalizes.">Hapgood</a> (1887)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>[...] four goblets, each of which bore a different wine and bore a different inscription -- <i>vin de singe, vin de lion, vin de mouton,</i> and <i>vin de cochon.</i>. They represented the four stages of intoxication -- gaiety, quarrelsomeness, dull-wittedness, and finally stupor.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/lesmiserables0000tran/page/446/mode/2up?q=%22different+inscription%22">Denny</a> (1976)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>On the first goblet he read the inscription "monkey wine," on the second "lion wine," on the third "sheep wine," on the fourth "swine wine." These four inscriptions expressed the four descending degrees of drunkenness: the first, which enlivens; the second, which irritates; the third, which stupefies; finally the last, which brutalizes.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://archive.org/details/lesmisrabl1987hugo/page/504/mode/2up?q=%22monkey+wine%22">Wilbour/Fahnestock/MacAfee</a> (1987)]</blockquote><br>

<blockquote>On the first goblet an inscription read: 'monkey's wine'; on the second, 'lion's wine'; on the third, 'sheep's wine'; on the fourth, 'hog's wine'. These four legends expressed the four stages of intoxication through which the drunkard descends: the first, of merriment; the second, of ill temper; the third, of dullness; and the fourth, of brutishness.<br>
[tr. <a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/Les_Miserables/dyKMDQAAQBAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&bsq=%22on%20the%20first%20goblet%22">Donougher</a> (2013)]</blockquote><br>
						</span>
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		<title>Herbert, George -- Jacula Prudentum, or Outlandish Proverbs, Sentences, &#038;c. (compiler), #  187 (1640 ed.)</title>
		<link>https://wist.info/herbert-george/10914/</link>
		<comments>https://wist.info/herbert-george/10914/#respond</comments>
		<pubDate>Thu, 13 May 2010 13:00:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Herbert, George]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[alcohol]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[drinking]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[drunkenness]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[inebriation]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[intelligence]]></category>
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		<description><![CDATA[Where the drink goes in, there the wit goes out.]]></description>
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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Where the drink goes in, there the wit goes out.</p>
<br><b>George Herbert</b> (1593-1633) Welsh priest, orator, poet.<br><i>Jacula Prudentum, or Outlandish Proverbs, Sentences, &#038;c.</i> (compiler), #  187 (1640 ed.) 
									<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;(<a href="https://archive.org/details/worksofgeorgeher030204mbp/page/326/mode/2up?q=%22drink+goes%22" target="_blank">Source</a>)
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		<title>Shakespeare, William -- Macbeth, Act 2, sc. 3, l.  27ff (2.3.27-38) (1606)</title>
		<link>https://wist.info/shakespeare-william/6626/</link>
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		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Dec 2008 13:39:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Shakespeare, William]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[alcohol]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[beer]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[drink]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[drinking]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[drunkenness]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[inebriation]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[lechery]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[libido]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[lust]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[performance]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[sex]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[sex drive]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[wine]]></category>

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		<description><![CDATA[PORTER: Drink, sir, is a great provoker of three things. MACDUFF: What three things does drink especially provoke? PORTER: Marry, sir, nose-painting, sleep, and urine. Lechery, sir, it provokes, and unprovokes; it provokes the desire, but it takes away the performance: therefore, much drink may be said to be an equivocator with lechery: it makes [&#8230;]]]></description>
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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p class="hangingindent">PORTER: Drink, sir, is a great provoker of three things.</p>
<p class="hangingindent">MACDUFF: What three things does drink especially provoke?</p>
<p class="hangingindent">PORTER: Marry, sir, nose-painting, sleep, and urine.<br />
Lechery, sir, it provokes, and unprovokes;<br />
it provokes the desire, but it takes away the performance:<br />
therefore, much drink may be said<br />
to be an equivocator with lechery:<br />
it makes him, and it mars him;<br />
it sets him on, and it takes him off;<br />
it persuades him, and disheartens him;<br />
makes him stand to, and not stand to;<br />
in conclusion, equivocates him in a sleep,<br />
and, giving him the lie, leaves him.</p>
<p></p>
<br><b>William Shakespeare</b> (1564-1616) English dramatist and poet<br><i>Macbeth</i>, Act 2, sc. 3, l.  27ff (2.3.27-38) (1606) 
									<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;(<a href="https://www.folger.edu/explore/shakespeares-works/macbeth/read/#:~:text=drink%2C%C2%A0sir%2C%C2%A0is,leaves%0A%C2%A0him." target="_blank">Source</a>)
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                <!-- DCH Modify the title to give the category (quote author) at the beginning of it. -->
		<title>Selden, John -- Table Talk, §  53.3 &#8220;Humility&#8221; (1689)</title>
		<link>https://wist.info/selden-john/6482/</link>
		<comments>https://wist.info/selden-john/6482/#respond</comments>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 Nov 2008 09:59:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Selden, John]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[dignity]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[drunkenness]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[excess]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[extremes]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[gluttony]]></category>
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		<category><![CDATA[pride]]></category>

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		<description><![CDATA[Pride may be allowed to this or that degree, else a man cannot keep up his dignity. In gluttony there must be eating, in drunkenness there must be drinking; &#8217;tis not the eating, nor &#8217;tis not the drinking that is to be blamed, but the excess. So in pride.]]></description>
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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Pride may be allowed to this or that degree, else a man cannot keep up his dignity. In gluttony there must be eating, in drunkenness there must be drinking; &#8217;tis not the eating, nor &#8217;tis not the drinking that is to be blamed, but the excess. So in pride.</p>
<br><b>John Selden</b> (1584-1654) English jurist, legal scholar, antiquarian, polymath<br><i>Table Talk</i>, §  53.3 &#8220;Humility&#8221; (1689) 
									<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;(<a href="https://www.google.com/books/edition/The_Table_Talk_of_John_Selden/50E4AAAAIAAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&bsq=%22pride%20may%20be%20allowed%22" target="_blank">Source</a>)
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                <!-- DCH Modify the title to give the category (quote author) at the beginning of it. -->
		<title>Byron, George Gordon, Lord -- Don Juan, Canto  2, st. 179  (1819)</title>
		<link>https://wist.info/byron/6139/</link>
		<comments>https://wist.info/byron/6139/#respond</comments>
		<pubDate>Thu, 31 Jul 2008 08:35:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Byron, George Gordon, Lord]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[drunkenness]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[exhilaration]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[human nature]]></category>
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		<category><![CDATA[thrill]]></category>

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		<description><![CDATA[Man, being reasonable, must get drunk; The best of life is but intoxication; Glory, the grape, love, gold, in these are sunk The hopes of all men, and of every nation.]]></description>
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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Man, being reasonable, must get drunk;<br />
The best of life is but intoxication;<br />
Glory, the grape, love, gold, in these are sunk<br />
The hopes of all men, and of every nation.</p>
<br><b>George Gordon, Lord Byron</b> (1788-1824) English poet<br><i>Don Juan</i>, Canto  2, st. 179  (1819) 
									<br>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;(<a href="https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Don_Juan_(Byron,_unsourced)/Canto_the_Second#:~:text=Man%2C%20being%20reasonable%2C%20must%20get%20drunk%3B%0A%C2%A0%C2%A0%C2%A0%C2%A0%C2%A0The%20best%20of%20life%20is%20but%20intoxication%3A%0AGlory%2C%20the%20grape%2C%20love%2C%20gold%2C%20in%20these%20are%20sunk%0A%C2%A0%C2%A0%C2%A0%C2%A0%C2%A0The%20hopes%20of%20all%20men%2C%20and%20of%20every%20nation" target="_blank">Source</a>)
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		<title>~Other -- Hokekyō Sho</title>
		<link>https://wist.info/other/5126/</link>
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		<pubDate>Sat, 21 Jul 2007 15:13:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[~Other]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[alcohol]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[drinking]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[drinks]]></category>
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		<category><![CDATA[wine]]></category>

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		<description><![CDATA[At the third cup, wine drinks the man. Literally, &#8220;Man drinks wine. Wine drinks wine. Wine drinks man.&#8221; A Buddhist Sanskrit text, quoted in Kojikotowaza Jiten [Dictionary of Traditions and Proverbs]. See also this Spanish proverb, Fitzgerald, and Piper. Referenced by Edward Rowland Sill (1841—1887) in &#8220;An Adage from the Orient&#8221;: At the punch-bowl&#8217;s brink, [&#8230;]]]></description>
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			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>At the third cup, wine drinks the man.</p>
<br>(Other Authors and Sources)<br><i>Hokekyō Sho</i> 
														<br><br><span class="cite">
						

Literally, "Man drinks wine. Wine drinks wine. Wine drinks man."  A Buddhist Sanskrit text, quoted in <i>Kojikotowaza Jiten [Dictionary of Traditions and Proverbs]</i>. <br><br>

See also this <a href="https://wist.info/other/4565/">Spanish proverb</a>, <a href="https://wist.info/fitzgerald-f-scott/8213/">Fitzgerald</a>, and <a href="https://wist.info/piper-h-beam/25082/">Piper</a>.<br><br>

Referenced by Edward Rowland Sill (1841—1887) in "An Adage from the Orient":<br><br>

<blockquote>At the punch-bowl's brink,<br>
Let the thirsty think<br>
What they say in Japan:<br>
'First the man takes a drink,'<br>
Then the drink takes a drink,<br>
Then the drink takes the man!'</blockquote>						</span>
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